[Sugar-devel] Abandoned or orphaned activities
Martin Dengler
martin at martindengler.com
Wed Jan 23 07:39:23 EST 2019
First, what are the numbers: extrapolating from this N=1 sample, how many activities can be maintained by a very experienced python and Sugar developer?
Regards
Martin
> On Jan 23, 2019, at 07:27, Dave Crossland <dave at lab6.com> wrote:
>
> James, are you soliciting SL pay you as a contractor to fix Activities not on the list?
>
>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019, 1:15 AM James Cameron <quozl at laptop.org wrote:
>> Nice idea, but hasn't happened yet, and I don't expect it to ever
>> happen without scaling up the number of testers and fixers.
>>
>> We just don't have enough people paying attention.
>>
>> How would you propose that attention be purchased? Sugar Labs has
>> $95k we could spend. You've seen from the list what my time can
>> accomplish each year, and that's not 100% of my time.
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 08:03:16AM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote:
>> > My original point was that as a community we should view the activities on
>> > ASLO as a corpus to be treasured and protected. No activity can be either
>> > abandoned or orphaned. It is the responsibility of the community. When a
>> > change 'upstream' breaks an activity or set of activities, the problem
>> > should be resolved as soon as possible.
>> >
>> > Tony
>> >
>> > On 1/23/19 6:07 AM, James Cameron wrote:
>> > >On Tue, Jan 22, 2019 at 09:54:08PM -0500, Walter Bender wrote:
>> > >>On Tue, Jan 22, 2019 at 9:13 PM James Cameron <[1]quozl at laptop.org> wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >> On Tue, Jan 22, 2019 at 01:29:56PM -0500, Devin Ulibarri wrote:
>> > >> > Hi,
>> > >> >
>> > >> > This was my experience:
>> > >> >
>> > >> > • I came into SugarLabs community at the time that this migration was
>> > >> > beginning to happen.
>> > >> > • I started a GH account because that is where I was told the software
>> > >> was
>> > >> > being maintained.
>> > >> > • I have continued to "go with the flow" and work via GH although I
>> > >> have come
>> > >> > to understand more of the history and context of this matter.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > These are my thoughts and opinions:
>> > >> >
>> > >> > • I remember an argument that one reason to move to GH is "that is
>> > >> where all
>> > >> > the developers are", but since our migration I have seen so many kids
>> > >> > (usually GCI) set up new accounts with GH in order to contribute to
>> > >> SL (and
>> > >> > to participate in GCI). This makes me think that many people are
>> > >> willing to
>> > >> > join our development regardless of whatever tools/services we use,
>> > >> and
>> > >> > whatever tool/services we use, if they are not yet setup with them,
>> > >> they
>> > >> > are willing to get setup in order to join development.
>> > >> > • Another argument seems to boil down to "we will be more productive
>> > >> using GH
>> > >> > because we need not worry about the hassle of maintaining our own
>> > >> code
>> > >> > hosting service". Is there evidence that we are more productive now
>> > >> than
>> > >> > before? Not having the opportunity to learn/use the other systems, I
>> > >> would
>> > >> > only be guessing.
>> > >>
>> > >> Not much evidence, it's about the same. Like any tooling, you get
>> > >> good at it with time. More productive now through the pull request
>> > >> and issue integration, but less productive through loss of situational
>> > >> awareness; changes are hidden in GitHub rather than being posted to
>> > >> sugar-devel@, and new developers fixate on their favourite
>> > >> repositories.
>> > >>
>> > >> > • In theory, SL running its own version control, seems to me like it
>> > >> would be
>> > >> > a) more fun for someone interested in this kind of work, b) a
>> > >> learning
>> > >> > opportunity, and c) gives maximum freedom/flexibility to the ways in
>> > >> which
>> > >> > we would like to do development.
>> > >>
>> > >> [2]git.sugarlabs.org hasn't needed any significant maintenance, and is
>> > >> probably insecure now because of vulnerabilities that haven't been
>> > >> patched.
>> > >>
>> > >> [3]bugs.sugarlabs.org has needed updates, but they have generally worked
>> > >> well.
>> > >>
>> > >>The spam issue made it almost unusable.
>> > >>
>> > >> > • I would rather be using software that is licensed under a FLOSS
>> > >> license
>> > >> > than a proprietary license. [4]gnu.org came up with some criteria to
>> > >> evaluate
>> > >> > "code hosting services" such as GH: [1][5]https://www.gnu.org/
>> > >> software/
>> > >> > repo-criteria.html (which, btw, gets an "F", the lowest grade) The
>> > >> whole
>> > >> > reason I am in this in the first place is because I believe the free/
>> > >> libre
>> > >> > model of software to be the best for society and education.
>> > >>
>> > >> Yes, I agree. Setting up an instance of GitLab could be done, but we
>> > >> would need someone willing to do that and maintain it. Or we could
>> > >> use GitLab directly as other projects have done.
>> > >>
>> > >>What does that accomplish at this point? (That being said, I use GitLab for
>> > >>other projects and it works just fine.)
>> > >All I can think of is closer compliance with intent of FSA 2(b), that
>> > >any and all software and documentation distributed by the Project will
>> > >be distributed solely as Free Software. But I've not heard from the
>> > >Conservancy on this.
>> > >
>> > >I don't think there are any other things that would be accomplished,
>> > >so it's not something I'm inclined to ask about.
>> > >
>> > >But I acknowledge Devin's concern; I too would rather be using
>> > >software that is licensed FLOSS than what we currently do.
>> > >
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Devin
>> > >> >
>> > >> > On Tue, 2019-01-22 at 07:15 +0200, Tony Anderson wrote:
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Walter,
>> > >> >
>> > >> > I will try. I am moving on Feb 3 to Palawan. I'll try to get to it
>> > >> then. My
>> > >> > principal concern re GSOC is to define projects with manageable scope
>> > >> -
>> > >> > many of the past projects ended undelivered.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Tony
>> > >> >
>> > >> > On 1/21/19 3:10 PM, Walter Bender wrote:
>> > >> >
>> > >> > On Mon, Jan 21, 2019 at 3:44 AM James Cameron <[2][6]
>> > >> quozl at laptop.org>
>> > >> > wrote:
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Fascinating, I never thought the move to GitHub was ever
>> > >> going to
>> > >> > achieve all that. It was to enable a shutdown of the
>> > >> unmaintained
>> > >> > gitorious instance at [3][7]git.sugarlabs.org. Which still
>> > >> hasn't
>> > >> > happened
>> > >> > because it is still useful, in turn because this community
>> > >> hasn't
>> > >> > the
>> > >> > time to do the necessary leg work to finish the move to
>> > >> GitHub.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > I would be curious what is still on Gitorious that hasn't been
>> > >> > migrated.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > FWIW, my principle motivations for the move were (1) as James
>> > >> points
>> > >> > out -- on less piece of infrastructure for us to maintain; and
>> > >> (2)
>> > >> > GitHub for better or worse is much more familiar to and likely to
>> > >> be
>> > >> > discovered by potential developers. I think GH has been a decent
>> > >> tool
>> > >> > which requires minimal effort on our part. Not sure that the
>> > >> latter
>> > >> > really amounts to too much.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Re Tony's point about the ownership model, I don't see that
>> > >> anything we
>> > >> > are doing suggests we don't want to continue to support
>> > >> individual
>> > >> > contributions. I interpreted James's list not as a matter of
>> > >> ownership
>> > >> > but rather a surfacing of what is actually happening re
>> > >> maintenance. In
>> > >> > some sense, what is being articulated is the equivalent of the
>> > >> Fructose
>> > >> > vs Honey nomenclature of the past where the core developers are
>> > >> saying:
>> > >> > "These activities will be maintained. Cannot speak for everything
>> > >> > else."
>> > >> >
>> > >> > That said, I think Tony makes a great point re thinking about the
>> > >> > pedagogical implications of our choices, which have had little if
>> > >> any
>> > >> > input from the learning side of the house. Would be great to get
>> > >> more
>> > >> > input to help us in regard to what is most valuable to our users
>> > >> > (whether they know it or not). [4]@Tony Anderson would be great
>> > >> if you
>> > >> > could rework you thoughts about Python into a GSoC idea.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > regards.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > -walter
>> > >> >
>> > >> >
>> > >> > In short, it has nothing to do with the tools, and everything
>> > >> to do
>> > >> > with contributors.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > I'll continue to focus on the activities I've got on my
>> > >> list. That
>> > >> > doesn't mean I won't help with the other activities, but I
>> > >> won't
>> > >> > necessarily spend as much time with the others.
>> > >> >
>> > >> > On Mon, Jan 21, 2019 at 09:12:01AM +0200, Tony Anderson
>> > >> wrote:
>> > >> > > While it is marvelous to see some actual attention to the
>> > >> Sugar
>> > >> > activities,
>> > >> > > this approach is the direct opposite of the logic behind
>> > >> the move
>> > >> > of the
>> > >> > > activities to gitHub. This is a return to the G1G1 model in
>> > >> which
>> > >> > individuals
>> > >> > > develop, contribute and own activities. There can be no
>> > >> abandoned
>> > >> > or orphaned
>> > >> > > activities in a community support model.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > It was recognized by Walter and others that there were two
>> > >> > factors which made
>> > >> > > that ownership model unworkable. First, changes in Sugar
>> > >> software
>> > >> > support such
>> > >> > > as the move to GTK3 made common changes to all activities
>> > >> > necessary and,
>> > >> > > second, that many of the original contributors are no
>> > >> longer
>> > >> > involved with
>> > >> > > Sugar.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > GitHub was touted as the way in which Sugar Labs as a
>> > >> community
>> > >> > would support
>> > >> > > Sugar and its library of activities. However, in practice
>> > >> support
>> > >> > for
>> > >> > > activities has become increasingly limited to a small
>> > >> number of
>> > >> > ones selected
>> > >> > > for inclusion in the 13.2 series of builds.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > The Sugar activities library is made available to our users
>> > >> via
>> > >> > ASLO.
>> > >> > > Unfortunately, there are activities with new versions in
>> > >> gitHub
>> > >> > which have not
>> > >> > > been released to ASLO and thus are unknown to our users.
>> > >> There is
>> > >> > even
>> > >> > > confusion over which 'github'. It has to be kept clear that
>> > >> > developers can use
>> > >> > > any method they chose. What is controlled is the repository
>> > >> on
>> > >> > gitHub. Any
>> > >> > > changes outside of the Sugar Labs github are invisible
>> > >> until they
>> > >> > are submitted
>> > >> > > as a new version.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Educational intent
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > What I would like to see is a return to the founding
>> > >> philosophy
>> > >> > of Sugar.
>> > >> > > Everyone is welcome to contribute. When you get 10 lines of
>> > >> code
>> > >> > working,
>> > >> > > submit your activity. Sugar is designed to provide all the
>> > >> > software tools
>> > >> > > needed to develop activities in Sugar - no
>> > >> cross-development,
>> > >> > containers, or
>> > >> > > virtual environments. Instead of requesting new
>> > >> contributors to
>> > >> > demonstrate
>> > >> > > their technical proficiency by putting their name on the XO
>> > >> icon
>> > >> > in the Home
>> > >> > > View, identify some real examples of changes that would
>> > >> improve
>> > >> > Sugar. There
>> > >> > > are plenty available:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Fix the icons on 'my settings' so they are visible instead
>> > >> of
>> > >> > switching to
>> > >> > > gnome by clicking on the big toe.
>> > >> > > When you take a screenshot and switch to the Journal to
>> > >> give it a
>> > >> > title, you
>> > >> > > must use the Frame to return, not the Activity key.
>> > >> > > The kids love the ability to customize their laptop with a
>> > >> > background picture.
>> > >> > > Unfortunately this often makes the icons in the Home View
>> > >> > invisible.
>> > >> > > Add Jupyter Notebook as a built-in capability of Sugar
>> > >> (possibly
>> > >> > as a service
>> > >> > > of Browse).
>> > >> > > Help solve problems with a long list of activities (such as
>> > >> the
>> > >> > lack of sound
>> > >> > > in Block Party).
>> > >> > > Find a way for Browse to support the css FlexBox.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Stop using Pippy as a ceiling to our users learning to
>> > >> program in
>> > >> > Python. They
>> > >> > > can work up to 'Make your own Sugar Activities'. Start
>> > >> with the
>> > >> > Hello World
>> > >> > > activity. Explain GTK and its benefits. PyDebug provides
>> > >> recipes
>> > >> > for many
>> > >> > > common coding situations. Stop hiding the Terminal and Log
>> > >> > activities - try to
>> > >> > > encourage them to become favorites. Soon we could see a new
>> > >> > generation of
>> > >> > > user-programmers as we did in Uruguay.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Along this theme, we should embrace the RPI and its
>> > >> compatriots
>> > >> > as a way to
>> > >> > > make embedded computing tangible. It would not be difficult
>> > >> to
>> > >> > connect such a
>> > >> > > device via the Ad Hoc network so that it could be used to
>> > >> > transfer a program
>> > >> > > written on an XO to the device and execute it with the user
>> > >> > seeing the results
>> > >> > > on LEDs (e.g. Sense Hat).
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Tony
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > On 1/20/19 3:48 PM, Walter Bender wrote:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > I noticed Dimensions fell off the list. I will take
>> > >> that one
>> > >> > on as I think
>> > >> > > it is of real value.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > -walter
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > On Sun, Jan 20, 2019 at 8:44 AM James Cameron <[1][5]
>> > >> > [8]quozl at laptop.org> wrote:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Thanks. So the list looks like;
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > # Walter Bender
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > * Music Blocks,
>> > >> > > * Turtle Blocks JS,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > # Rahul Bothra
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > * CowBulls,
>> > >> > > * Flappy,
>> > >> > > * Cedit,
>> > >> > > * Polari,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > # James Cameron
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > * Abacus,
>> > >> > > * Browse (master),
>> > >> > > * Browse (fedora 18 - webkit - v157.x),
>> > >> > > * Calculator,
>> > >> > > * Chart,
>> > >> > > * Chat,
>> > >> > > * Clock,
>> > >> > > * Develop,
>> > >> > > * Distance,
>> > >> > > * Finance,
>> > >> > > * Find Words,
>> > >> > > * Fototoon,
>> > >> > > * Fraction Bounce,
>> > >> > > * Gears,
>> > >> > > * GetBooks,
>> > >> > > * Help,
>> > >> > > * ImageViewer,
>> > >> > > * Implode,
>> > >> > > * Jukebox,
>> > >> > > * Labyrinth,
>> > >> > > * Letters,
>> > >> > > * Log,
>> > >> > > * Maze,
>> > >> > > * Measure,
>> > >> > > * Memorize,
>> > >> > > * Moon (master),
>> > >> > > * Moon (fedora 18 - gtk2 - v17.x),
>> > >> > > * MusicKeyboard (master),
>> > >> > > * MusicKeyboard (fedora 18 - csound - v8.x),
>> > >> > > * Paint,
>> > >> > > * Physics,
>> > >> > > * Pippy,
>> > >> > > * Poll,
>> > >> > > * Portfolio,
>> > >> > > * Read (master),
>> > >> > > * Read (fedora 18 - webkit - v118.x),
>> > >> > > * Record (master),
>> > >> > > * Record (fedora 18 - gstreamer - v10x),
>> > >> > > * SimpleEnglishWikipedia,
>> > >> > > * Speak,
>> > >> > > * StopWatch,
>> > >> > > * Story,
>> > >> > > * Terminal,
>> > >> > > * TurtleBlocks,
>> > >> > > * Words,
>> > >> > > * Write,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > On Fri, Jan 18, 2019 at 09:04:50AM -0500, Walter
>> > >> Bender
>> > >> > wrote:
>> > >> > > > I am actively maintaining Music Blocks and Turtle
>> > >> > Blocks JS.
>> > >> > > > I just haven't had the bandwidth to do much
>> > >> beyond that
>> > >> > of late. That
>> > >> > > said, I
>> > >> > > > am happy to kibbutz on any of the activities
>> > >> which I
>> > >> > used to
>> > >> > > maintain.
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > On Fri, Jan 18, 2019 at 3:11 AM Rahul Bothra <[1]
>> > >> [2]
>> > >> > > [6][9]rrbothra at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > *
>> > >> > > > I am maintaining CowBulls and Flappy.
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > I can take up cedit and Polari
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > On Fri, Jan 18, 2019 at 12:53 PM James
>> > >> Cameron <[2]
>> > >> > [3]
>> > >> > > [7][10]quozl at laptop.org> wrote:
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > Once we had a list of abandoned
>> > >> activities,
>> > >> > where the
>> > >> > > maintainer is
>> > >> > > > missing in action, not doing testing or
>> > >> > releasing.
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > Now, I propose the inverse; a list of
>> > >> > activities with a
>> > >> > > maintainer
>> > >> > > > testing and releasing. It will be easier
>> > >> to
>> > >> > maintain that
>> > >> > > list.
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > For myself, each of the Fructose
>> > >> activities,
>> > >> > each of the
>> > >> > > activities we
>> > >> > > > ship on OLPC OS. I know Walter is
>> > >> looking
>> > >> > after Music
>> > >> > > Blocks. Lionel
>> > >> > > > is looking after Sugarizer. Are there
>> > >> any
>> > >> > other developers
>> > >> > > who are
>> > >> > > > maintainers?
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > --
>> > >> > > > James Cameron
>> > >> > > > [3][4][8][11]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> > > > Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > >> > > > [4][5][9][12]
>> > >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > > [5][6][10][13]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> listinfo/
>> > >> > sugar-devel
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> > > > Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > >> > > > [6][7][11][14]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > > [7][8][12][15]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> listinfo/
>> > >> > sugar-devel
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > --
>> > >> > > > Walter Bender
>> > >> > > > Sugar Labs
>> > >> > > > [8][9][13][16]http://www.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > > [9]
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > References:
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > [1] mailto:[10][14][17]rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >> > > > [2] mailto:[11][15][18]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > > > [3] [12][16][19]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > > > [4] mailto:[13][17][20]
>> > >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > > [5] [14][18][21]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> listinfo/
>> > >> > sugar-devel
>> > >> > > > [6] mailto:[15][19][22]
>> > >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > > [7] [16][20][23]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> listinfo/
>> > >> > sugar-devel
>> > >> > > > [8] [17][21][24]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > > > [9] [18][22][25]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > --
>> > >> > > James Cameron
>> > >> > > [19][23][26]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > > Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > >> > > [20][24][27]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > [21][25][28]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/
>> > >> sugar-devel
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > --
>> > >> > > Walter Bender
>> > >> > > Sugar Labs
>> > >> > > [22][26][29]http://www.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > > Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > >> > > [23][27][30]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > [24][28][31]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/
>> > >> sugar-devel
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > References:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > [1] mailto:[29][32]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > > [2] mailto:[30][33]rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >> > > [3] mailto:[31][34]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > > [4] [32][35]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > > [5] mailto:[33][36]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > [6] [34][37]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > > [7] mailto:[35][38]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > [8] [36][39]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > > [9] [37][40]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > > [10] mailto:[38][41]rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >> > > [11] mailto:[39][42]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > > [12] [40][43]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > > [13] mailto:[41][44]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > [14] [42][45]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/
>> > >> sugar-devel
>> > >> > > [15] mailto:[43][46]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > [16] [44][47]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/
>> > >> sugar-devel
>> > >> > > [17] [45][48]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > > [18] [46][49]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > > [19] [47][50]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > > [20] mailto:[48][51]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > [21] [49][52]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/
>> > >> sugar-devel
>> > >> > > [22] [50][53]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > > [23] mailto:[51][54]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > [24] [52][55]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/
>> > >> sugar-devel
>> > >> >
>> > >> > > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > > Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > >> > > [53][56]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > > [54][57]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> >
>> > >> > --
>> > >> > James Cameron
>> > >> > [55][58]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > >> > [56][59]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [57][60]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> >
>> > >> > --
>> > >> > Walter Bender
>> > >> > Sugar Labs
>> > >> > [58][61]http://www.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> >
>> > >> >
>> > >> > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > >> > [59][62]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [60][63]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> >
>> > >> > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > >> > [61][64]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [62][65]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> >
>> > >> > References:
>> > >> >
>> > >> > [1] [66]https://www.gnu.org/software/repo-criteria.html
>> > >> > [2] mailto:[67]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > [3] [68]http://git.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > [4] mailto:[69]tony_anderson at usa.net
>> > >> > [5] mailto:[70]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > [6] mailto:[71]rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >> > [7] mailto:[72]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > [8] [73]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > [9] mailto:[74]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [10] [75]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [11] mailto:[76]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [12] [77]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [13] [78]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > [14] mailto:[79]rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >> > [15] mailto:[80]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > [16] [81]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > [17] mailto:[82]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [18] [83]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [19] mailto:[84]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [20] [85]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [21] [86]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > [22] [87]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > [23] [88]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > [24] mailto:[89]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [25] [90]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [26] [91]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > [27] mailto:[92]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [28] [93]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [29] mailto:[94]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > [30] mailto:[95]rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >> > [31] mailto:[96]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > [32] [97]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > [33] mailto:[98]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [34] [99]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [35] mailto:[100]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [36] [101]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [37] [102]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > [38] mailto:[103]rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >> > [39] mailto:[104]quozl at laptop.org
>> > >> > [40] [105]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > [41] mailto:[106]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [42] [107]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [43] mailto:[108]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [44] [109]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [45] [110]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > [46] [111]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > [47] [112]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > [48] mailto:[113]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [49] [114]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [50] [115]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > [51] mailto:[116]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [52] [117]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [53] mailto:[118]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [54] [119]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [55] [120]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> > [56] mailto:[121]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [57] [122]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [58] [123]http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >> > [59] mailto:[124]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [60] [125]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >> > [61] mailto:[126]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [62] [127]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>
>> > >> > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > >> > [128]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> > [129]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>
>> > >> --
>> > >> James Cameron
>> > >> [130]http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > >> [131]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >> [132]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>
>> > >>--
>> > >>Walter Bender
>> > >>Sugar Labs
>> > >>[133]http://www.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[134]
>> > >>
>> > >>References:
>> > >>
>> > >>[1] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[2] http://git.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[3] http://bugs.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[4] http://gnu.org/
>> > >>[5] https://www.gnu.org/software/
>> > >>[6] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[7] http://git.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[8] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[9] mailto:rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >>[10] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[11] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[12] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[13] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/
>> > >>[14] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[15] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/
>> > >>[16] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[17] mailto:rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >>[18] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[19] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[20] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[21] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/
>> > >>[22] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[23] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/
>> > >>[24] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[25] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[26] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[27] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[28] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[29] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[30] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[31] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[32] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[33] mailto:rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >>[34] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[35] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[36] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[37] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[38] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[39] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[40] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[41] mailto:rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >>[42] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[43] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[44] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[45] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[46] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[47] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[48] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[49] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[50] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[51] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[52] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[53] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[54] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[55] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[56] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[57] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[58] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[59] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[60] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[61] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[62] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[63] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[64] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[65] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[66] https://www.gnu.org/software/repo-criteria.html
>> > >>[67] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[68] http://git.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[69] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net
>> > >>[70] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[71] mailto:rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >>[72] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[73] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[74] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[75] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[76] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[77] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[78] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[79] mailto:rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >>[80] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[81] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[82] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[83] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[84] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[85] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[86] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[87] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[88] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[89] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[90] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[91] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[92] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[93] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[94] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[95] mailto:rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >>[96] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[97] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[98] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[99] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[100] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[101] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[102] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[103] mailto:rrbothra at gmail.com
>> > >>[104] mailto:quozl at laptop.org
>> > >>[105] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[106] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[107] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[108] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[109] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[110] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[111] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[112] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[113] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[114] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[115] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[116] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[117] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[118] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[119] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[120] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[121] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[122] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[123] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[124] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[125] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[126] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[127] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[128] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[129] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[130] http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> > >>[131] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > >>[132] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>> > >>[133] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> > >>[134] http://www.sugarlabs.org/
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Sugar-devel mailing list
>> > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>>
>> --
>> James Cameron
>> http://quozl.netrek.org/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sugar-devel mailing list
>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
> _______________________________________________
> Sugar-devel mailing list
> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
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