[Sugar-devel] The future of Sugar on XO-1s

Tony Anderson tony_anderson at usa.net
Tue May 31 03:10:31 EDT 2016


Hi, Dave

No, I intended it to go to the list.

Thanks,

Tony

On 05/30/2016 06:23 PM, Dave Crossland wrote:
> Hi
>
> did you intend to reply offlist?
>
> On 30 May 2016 at 01:23, Tony Anderson <tony_anderson at usa.net 
> <mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net>> wrote:
>
>     Hi, Dave
>
>     My first impression of the vision proposal is that it doesn't
>     speak to the educational goal of Sugar. It doesn't answer the
>     question: Why Sugar?
>     Why does anyone need Sugar? What are its goals and unique
>     contribution?
>
>     Sugar is intended to fulfill an educational vision. Even on the
>     Sugar Labs website mention of Seymour Papert and Alan Kay is
>     relegated to the
>     Education Team page and even then with no discussion of their
>     vision and how it relates to Sugar.
>
>     It was developed as the learning environment for the XO to provide
>     improved educational opportunity
>     for children who did not have access to digital technology.
>
>     Formal education tends to treat computers as advanced typewriters
>     to be taught as a subject.
>     Sugar attempts to break that bond so that computers are used
>     actively to promote learning across all subjects.
>
>     Tony
>
>     On 05/30/2016 04:36 AM, Dave Crossland wrote:
>>     Hi
>>
>>     I want to return to this older thread because of James Cameron's
>>     comment in
>>     https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/pull/688#issuecomment-222393275 :
>>
>>         On the assumption that Sugar Labs is dropping support for
>>         XO-1, I'll close this pull request. Thanks for your time!
>>
>>
>>     But I understood from Tony and Adam in this thread that Sugar
>>     Labs _should_ keep support for the XO-1 as a goal. Adam said,
>>
>>         In Haiti XO-1s will be dominant across many schools for years
>>         and year to come. Similar to Tony's description, but these
>>         typically will be using 32GB SD cards -- thankfully these are
>>         incredibly affordable. The resilience/repairability of the
>>         XO-1 laptops is the absolutely fascinating part.
>>
>>
>>     I think this goal is wise because it ensures that Sugar runs well
>>     on the cheapest computers - like the $10
>>     getchip.com/pages/pocketchip
>>     <http://getchip.com/pages/pocketchip> and $5
>>     https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/raspberry-pi-zero - and ensures
>>     performance is only better on later XO models and 'regular'
>>     desktops/laptops.
>>
>>     I edited https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Vision_proposal_2016 to
>>     reflect this.
>>
>>     Cheers
>>     Dave
>>
>>
>>     On 5 April 2016 at 17:04, James Cameron <quozl at laptop.org
>>     <mailto:quozl at laptop.org>> wrote:
>>
>>         On Tue, Apr 05, 2016 at 07:37:45AM -0400, Dave Crossland wrote:
>>         >
>>         > Hi James
>>         >
>>         > On 1 April 2016 at 15:06, James Cameron
>>         <[1]quozl at laptop.org <mailto:quozl at laptop.org>> wrote:
>>         >
>>         >     Let me spin you a tail.
>>         >
>>         >     The myth of forward human development doesn't apply to
>>         software.
>>         >
>>         >     This is a parade of people, several walking abreast,
>>         beside a slow
>>         >     moving flat bed truck, all holding on to a ribbon.
>>         >
>>         >     The truck is the world, and the internet as it stands.
>>         >
>>         >     The first person, next to the truck, are our learners
>>         or users.
>>         >
>>         >     The second person is Sugar Labs; with our activities,
>>         and Sugar.
>>         >
>>         >     The third person is distributions of Linux, like Fedora
>>         and Ubuntu,
>>         >
>>         >     The fourth person are the hardware vendors, like
>>         commodity suppliers
>>         >     or OLPC.
>>         >
>>         >     The fifth person are the Linux kernel developers.
>>         >
>>         >     As the procession walks beside the truck, the ribbon is
>>         not always
>>         >     straight.
>>         >
>>         >     Some people walk faster than others.  Some let go of
>>         the ribbon and
>>         >     others take their place.
>>         >
>>         >     I'm glad you're here, you're bringing a new perspective.
>>         >
>>         >     But the ribbon is actually toilet paper, so the
>>         pressure to keep up,
>>         >     while real, doesn't get felt, instead the paper breaks.
>>         >
>>         >     Do not target a rapidly diminishing enthusiastic group,
>>         or the future
>>         >     users will suffer.
>>         >
>>         > I'm sorry, I didn't fully understand you here at the last
>>         line. You had said
>>         > earlier,
>>         >
>>         > >     for the future of Sugar Labs, they should be
>>         concentrating on
>>         > >     later designs than one from 2007 that is no longer
>>         available and
>>         > >     rapidly dying from old age.
>>         >
>>         > So you mean, it would be unwise for Sugar Lab's
>>         vision/mission/strategy for the
>>         > next 3-5 years to focus on supporting the rapidly
>>         diminishing (yet
>>         > enthusiastic) group of XO owners, and focus on the future
>>         users who are not XO
>>         > owners?
>>
>>         You might target this group of XO-1 owners and become a closed
>>         community into which all communications are judged against
>>         suitability
>>         for the majority (which would then be XO-1 owners).
>>
>>         It would feel good!  [warning, sarcasm in this paragraph]
>>
>>         I'm loath to battle the laws of physics, 'cause I know who wins.
>>
>>         --
>>         James Cameron
>>         http://quozl.netrek.org/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>     -- 
>>     Cheers
>>     Dave
>>
>>
>>     _______________________________________________
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>>     <mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org>
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>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Cheers
> Dave

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