From walter.bender at gmail.com Sat Aug 1 08:01:58 2015 From: walter.bender at gmail.com (Walter Bender) Date: Sat, 1 Aug 2015 08:01:58 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] meeting reminder Message-ID: We meet on Monday, 3 August at 23:00 UTC, 7PM Boston, 19:00 Asuncion, 09:00+1 Sydney, 23:00 Paris, 20:00 BA, 20:00 Montevideo, 20:00 Sao Paulo 17:00 Managua, 18:00 Bogota, 04:30+1 New Delhi. We need to wrap up the discussion about the oversight board elections and touch base re plans for the next release. regards. -walter -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org From francis at sugarlabs.org Sun Aug 2 18:13:52 2015 From: francis at sugarlabs.org (S. Daniel Francis) Date: Sun, 2 Aug 2015 19:13:52 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [SLOBS] meeting reminder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hey, I cannot attend the meeting tomorrow. Can we please move the meeting to next week and one hour later? 2015-08-01 9:01 GMT-03:00 Walter Bender : > We meet on Monday, 3 August at 23:00 UTC, 7PM Boston, 19:00 Asuncion, > 09:00+1 Sydney, 23:00 Paris, 20:00 BA, 20:00 Montevideo, 20:00 Sao > Paulo 17:00 Managua, 18:00 Bogota, 04:30+1 New Delhi. > > We need to wrap up the discussion about the oversight board elections > and touch base re plans for the next release. > > regards. > > -walter > -- > Walter Bender > Sugar Labs > http://www.sugarlabs.org > _______________________________________________ > SLOBs mailing list > SLOBs at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/slobs From walter.bender at gmail.com Mon Aug 3 10:38:16 2015 From: walter.bender at gmail.com (Walter Bender) Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2015 10:38:16 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] meeting reminder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Meeting postponement In order to accommodate the schedule of several board members, we will be postponing the August SLOB meeting until Monday, 10 August. Also, the hour will shift as follows: 24:00 UTC, 8PM Boston, 20:00 Asuncion, 10:00+1 Sydney, 24:00 Paris, 21:00 BA, 21:00 Montevideo, 21:00 Sao Paulo 18:00 Managua, 19:00 Bogota, 04:30+1 New Delhi. On Sat, Aug 1, 2015 at 8:01 AM, Walter Bender wrote: > We meet on Monday, 3 August at 23:00 UTC, 7PM Boston, 19:00 Asuncion, > 09:00+1 Sydney, 23:00 Paris, 20:00 BA, 20:00 Montevideo, 20:00 Sao > Paulo 17:00 Managua, 18:00 Bogota, 04:30+1 New Delhi. > > We need to wrap up the discussion about the oversight board elections > and touch base re plans for the next release. > > regards. > > -walter > -- > Walter Bender > Sugar Labs > http://www.sugarlabs.org -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org From samsongoddy at hotmail.com Mon Aug 3 11:56:28 2015 From: samsongoddy at hotmail.com (samson goddy) Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2015 16:56:28 +0100 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [SLOBS] meeting reminder In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: I can't make it to the Meeting because of the time. Nigerian GMT+1 (12:00AM) that i can't make it. I could be only available 07:00 pm Nigerian Time till 9:00pm. Best regards Samson > From: francis at sugarlabs.org > Date: Sun, 2 Aug 2015 19:13:52 -0300 > To: walter.bender at gmail.com > CC: iaep at lists.sugarlabs.org; sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org; olpc-sur at lists.laptop.org; slobs at lists.sugarlabs.org > Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] [SLOBS] meeting reminder > > Hey, > I cannot attend the meeting tomorrow. > > Can we please move the meeting to next week and one hour later? > > 2015-08-01 9:01 GMT-03:00 Walter Bender : > > We meet on Monday, 3 August at 23:00 UTC, 7PM Boston, 19:00 Asuncion, > > 09:00+1 Sydney, 23:00 Paris, 20:00 BA, 20:00 Montevideo, 20:00 Sao > > Paulo 17:00 Managua, 18:00 Bogota, 04:30+1 New Delhi. > > > > We need to wrap up the discussion about the oversight board elections > > and touch base re plans for the next release. > > > > regards. > > > > -walter > > -- > > Walter Bender > > Sugar Labs > > http://www.sugarlabs.org > > _______________________________________________ > > SLOBs mailing list > > SLOBs at lists.sugarlabs.org > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/slobs > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at sugarlabs.org Mon Aug 3 13:57:20 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2015 14:57:20 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] license of layout.py in Sugar Calculate activity In-Reply-To: References: <20150618171457.2498.92226@auryn.jones.dk> <20150618182027.2498.64506@auryn.jones.dk> <20150618193041.2498.59797@auryn.jones.dk> <20150618213920.GA27609@us.netrek.org> <20150730040423.GK14871@us.netrek.org> <20150731060524.GH12055@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: Thanks, merged On Mon, Aug 3, 2015 at 1:14 PM, Aneesh Dogra wrote: > Added: https://github.com/godiard/sugarlabs-calculate/pull/29 > > On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 6:07 PM, Gonzalo Odiard > wrote: > >> Anesh, James, >> As the sugarlabs-caalculate project was inactive from 2013, >> and we had GCI students sending patches, I forked the repository >> and the latest version is here: >> https://github.com/godiard/sugarlabs-calculate >> >> I already added a patch similar to Aneesh patch, but made the same >> mistake, >> >> Aneesh, please send a patch fixing the error pointed by James to apply in >> the new repository. >> >> Gonzalo >> >> >> >> On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 3:05 AM, James Cameron wrote: >> >>> That's almost correct. The license should be after the copyright. So >>> move line 17 to line 2. ;-} >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 10:47:00AM +0530, Aneesh Dogra wrote: >>> > Here you go: >>> > [1]https://github.com/lionaneesh/sugarlabs-calculate/commit/ >>> > 8df47288de11b9fdc61e4811515110f7b44ee925 >>> > >>> > On Thu, Jul 30, 2015 at 9:34 AM, James Cameron <[2]quozl at laptop.org> >>> wrote: >>> > >>> > G'day Aneesh, >>> > >>> > Thanks for coming back to us on this. >>> > >>> > Yes, you can do something, and you are the only person who can do >>> it, >>> > because you are the copyright owner. >>> > >>> > You just have to edit a file. >>> > >>> > As an example of a good file, look at plotlib.py, see how it has >>> both >>> > a copyright (line 2) and a license (lines 4-16). >>> > >>> > [3] >>> https://github.com/lionaneesh/sugarlabs-calculate/blob/sugar-0.94/ >>> > plotlib.py >>> > >>> > It is the layout.py file with a problem. >>> > >>> > [4] >>> https://github.com/lionaneesh/sugarlabs-calculate/blob/sugar-0.94/ >>> > layout.py >>> > >>> > Clone the source code in your git repository >>> > [5]https://github.com/lionaneesh/sugarlabs-calculate >>> > >>> > Open the file layout.py, edit it, add the license, commit the >>> changes, >>> > and then push to your repository. >>> > >>> > That's all! >>> > >>> > If you can't push for some reason, you can prepare a git patch and >>> > post it as a reply. As long as it comes from you. >>> > >>> > References: >>> > >>> > [6] >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2015-June/050399.html >>> > >>> > On Mon, Jul 27, 2015 at 12:15:11PM +0530, Aneesh Dogra wrote: >>> > > Hello all, >>> > > >>> > > Sorry. I was on a long vacation. Getting back on my emails now. >>> Can I do >>> > > something about this? >>> > > >>> > > On Fri, Jun 19, 2015 at 3:21 AM, Gonzalo Odiard <[1][7] >>> > godiard at sugarlabs.org> >>> > > wrote: >>> > > >>> > > I am afraid you will find many other activities where the >>> license >>> > notation >>> > > is >>> > > in the same state. >>> > > If the current maintainer can't solve the problem, I have >>> nothing to >>> > do, >>> > > but then don't complain :) >>> > > >>> > > Gonzalo >>> > > >>> > > On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 6:39 PM, James Cameron <[2][8] >>> > quozl at laptop.org> wrote: >>> > > >>> > > I'm with Jonas on this. >>> > > >>> > > The fault is a copyright statement in a work without a >>> license, >>> > and >>> > > yes, only the original copyright owner can correct it. >>> > > >>> > > In my opinion, that correction can be a mail reply from >>> the >>> > original >>> > > copyright owner saying "Gonzalo, please add this license >>> short >>> > text", >>> > > or "Gonzalo, please remove the copyright line." >>> > > >>> > > (Best is the first). >>> > > >>> > > Or it can be a patch. >>> > > >>> > > But it's not something the new maintainer can _ever_ do, >>> alone. >>> > > >>> > > I now have to reconsider inclusion of this activity. >>> Don't let >>> > that >>> > > happen again! ;-) >>> > > >>> > > -- >>> > > James Cameron >>> > > [3][9]http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > -- >>> > > Gonzalo Odiard >>> > > >>> > > SugarLabs - Software for children learning >>> > > >>> > > -- >>> > > Regardless, I hope you're well and happy - >>> > > Aneesh >>> > > >>> > > References: >>> > > >>> > > [1] mailto:[10]godiard at sugarlabs.org >>> > > [2] mailto:[11]quozl at laptop.org >>> > > [3] [12]http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >>> > >>> > -- >>> > James Cameron >>> > [13]http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >>> > >>> > -- >>> > Regardless, I hope you're well and happy - >>> > Aneesh >>> > >>> > References: >>> > >>> > [1] >>> https://github.com/lionaneesh/sugarlabs-calculate/commit/8df47288de11b9fdc61e4811515110f7b44ee925 >>> > [2] mailto:quozl at laptop.org >>> > [3] >>> https://github.com/lionaneesh/sugarlabs-calculate/blob/sugar-0.94/plotlib.py >>> > [4] >>> https://github.com/lionaneesh/sugarlabs-calculate/blob/sugar-0.94/layout.py >>> > [5] https://github.com/lionaneesh/sugarlabs-calculate >>> > [6] >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2015-June/050399.html >>> > [7] mailto:godiard at sugarlabs.org >>> > [8] mailto:quozl at laptop.org >>> > [9] http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >>> > [10] mailto:godiard at sugarlabs.org >>> > [11] mailto:quozl at laptop.org >>> > [12] http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >>> > [13] http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >>> >>> -- >>> James Cameron >>> http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Gonzalo Odiard >> >> SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning >> > > > > -- > Regardless, I hope you're well and happy - > Aneesh > -- Gonzalo Odiard SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cbigenho at hotmail.com Mon Aug 3 18:49:25 2015 From: cbigenho at hotmail.com (Caryl Bigenho) Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2015 16:49:25 -0600 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] meeting reminder In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: Hi Folks, I won't be able to be there. I will be picking up my son and grandson at the end of the 80+ mile backcountry hike they started in Yellowstone National Park today. I will have no internet access at all that day and most of the day before. Sorry. If you would like, I can make a short document about the elections/membership/newsletter and include questions I will have for the board. I'll try to send this by Saturday, if all goes well. Maybe Sebastian will be able to attend. Caryl > Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2015 10:38:16 -0400 > From: walter.bender at gmail.com > To: slobs at lists.sugarlabs.org > CC: iaep at lists.sugarlabs.org; sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org; olpc-sur at lists.laptop.org > Subject: Re: [IAEP] meeting reminder > > Meeting postponement > > In order to accommodate the schedule of several board members, we will > be postponing the August SLOB meeting until Monday, 10 August. Also, > the hour will shift as follows: > > 24:00 UTC, 8PM Boston, 20:00 Asuncion, > 10:00+1 Sydney, 24:00 Paris, 21:00 BA, 21:00 Montevideo, 21:00 Sao > Paulo 18:00 Managua, 19:00 Bogota, 04:30+1 New Delhi. > > On Sat, Aug 1, 2015 at 8:01 AM, Walter Bender wrote: > > We meet on Monday, 3 August at 23:00 UTC, 7PM Boston, 19:00 Asuncion, > > 09:00+1 Sydney, 23:00 Paris, 20:00 BA, 20:00 Montevideo, 20:00 Sao > > Paulo 17:00 Managua, 18:00 Bogota, 04:30+1 New Delhi. > > > > We need to wrap up the discussion about the oversight board elections > > and touch base re plans for the next release. > > > > regards. > > > > -walter > > -- > > Walter Bender > > Sugar Labs > > http://www.sugarlabs.org > > > > -- > Walter Bender > Sugar Labs > http://www.sugarlabs.org > _______________________________________________ > IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) > IAEP at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cbigenho at hotmail.com Mon Aug 3 19:01:26 2015 From: cbigenho at hotmail.com (Caryl Bigenho) Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2015 17:01:26 -0600 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] meeting reminder In-Reply-To: References: , , , Message-ID: P.S. To my past note? I still need more "news" stories from Sugar Labs members about their latest projects. I have enough for a story about GSOC, and Gonzalo sent a good (but long) article about writing documentation over the years and how he(we) need help updating, revising, and translating and localizing the Help Activity. I really want articles on the school server project, the latest SOAS, and Sugarizer. If you are willing to write such an article (approx 500 words) or would be willing to answer my written interview questions on one of these topics, please let me know? the sooner the better! Articles on robotics could be nice? Rosamel are you reading? and some of the Turtle Blocks workshops Walter has been doing around the world? maybe Caroline Meeks could team up with Walter for the latter. Pictures are needed for all except the GSOC article? thank you Lionel Lask? for the photo of you with Micha?l. Caryl From: cbigenho at hotmail.com To: walter.bender at gmail.com; slobs at lists.sugarlabs.org Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2015 16:49:25 -0600 CC: iaep at lists.sugarlabs.org; sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org; olpc-sur at lists.laptop.org Subject: Re: [IAEP] meeting reminder Hi Folks, I won't be able to be there. I will be picking up my son and grandson at the end of the 80+ mile backcountry hike they started in Yellowstone National Park today. I will have no internet access at all that day and most of the day before. Sorry. If you would like, I can make a short document about the elections/membership/newsletter and include questions I will have for the board. I'll try to send this by Saturday, if all goes well. Maybe Sebastian will be able to attend. Caryl > Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2015 10:38:16 -0400 > From: walter.bender at gmail.com > To: slobs at lists.sugarlabs.org > CC: iaep at lists.sugarlabs.org; sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org; olpc-sur at lists.laptop.org > Subject: Re: [IAEP] meeting reminder > > Meeting postponement > > In order to accommodate the schedule of several board members, we will > be postponing the August SLOB meeting until Monday, 10 August. Also, > the hour will shift as follows: > > 24:00 UTC, 8PM Boston, 20:00 Asuncion, > 10:00+1 Sydney, 24:00 Paris, 21:00 BA, 21:00 Montevideo, 21:00 Sao > Paulo 18:00 Managua, 19:00 Bogota, 04:30+1 New Delhi. > > On Sat, Aug 1, 2015 at 8:01 AM, Walter Bender wrote: > > We meet on Monday, 3 August at 23:00 UTC, 7PM Boston, 19:00 Asuncion, > > 09:00+1 Sydney, 23:00 Paris, 20:00 BA, 20:00 Montevideo, 20:00 Sao > > Paulo 17:00 Managua, 18:00 Bogota, 04:30+1 New Delhi. > > > > We need to wrap up the discussion about the oversight board elections > > and touch base re plans for the next release. > > > > regards. > > > > -walter > > -- > > Walter Bender > > Sugar Labs > > http://www.sugarlabs.org > > > > -- > Walter Bender > Sugar Labs > http://www.sugarlabs.org > _______________________________________________ > IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) > IAEP at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep _______________________________________________ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) IAEP at lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From samsongoddy at hotmail.com Tue Aug 4 16:04:47 2015 From: samsongoddy at hotmail.com (samson goddy) Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 21:04:47 +0100 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Request for membership In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello, Otun Ridwan Adeola, Thanks for your interest in Sugar Labs organization. Here are some links to get to know sugarlabs better http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Welcome_to_the_Sugar_Labs_wiki This is also how you could get started in developing in the sugar labs community https://developer.sugarlabs.org/ , https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ this is our bugs if you're interested in fixing one. Note: In order to get a membership approval in the this organization you need to available, working with other developers in fixing and creating activities. http://activities.sugarlabs.org/en-US/sugar/ . If your interested in runing Sugar OS in your laptop (Windows OS) http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick and also link our Facebook page and share in order to spread the word!!!!! https://www.facebook.com/pages/SugarLabs/187845102582 If you have any questions please do ask. Best regards Samson Goddy Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 17:07:38 +0100 Subject: Request for membership From: readonegoke at gmail.com To: sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org; samsongoddy at sugarlabs.org Hello, I am Otun Ridwan Adeola, i am a Nigerian and computer programmer. I basically have knowledge in HTML5, CSS, bootstrap and java. I got a referral from samson Goddy, and i would be glad and willing to contribute to the open source program "sugar OS if my membership request is granted by your worthy organization. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at sugarlabs.org Tue Aug 4 16:10:16 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 17:10:16 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Request for membership In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Otun, You don't need be a member to start to participate. If you know HTML5/javascript/css, we are starting to develop activities with that technologies (previously only used python). You can check developer.sugarlabs.org for more information, and subscribe to sugar-devel mailing list to coordinate work or ask technical questions. https://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel Gonzalo On Tue, Aug 4, 2015 at 5:04 PM, samson goddy wrote: > Hello, Otun Ridwan Adeola, Thanks for your interest in Sugar Labs > organization. Here are some links to get to know sugarlabs better > http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Welcome_to_the_Sugar_Labs_wiki This is also > how you could get started in developing in the sugar labs community > https://developer.sugarlabs.org/ , https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ this is > our bugs if you're interested in fixing one. > > Note: In order to get a membership approval in the this organization > you need to available, working with other developers in fixing and creating > activities. http://activities.sugarlabs.org/en-US/sugar/ . If your > interested in runing Sugar OS in your laptop (Windows OS) > http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick and also link our Facebook > page and share in order to spread the word!!!!! *https://www.facebook.com/pages/SugarLabs/187845102582 > *If you have any > questions please do ask. > > > Best regards > > Samson Goddy > > ------------------------------ > Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2015 17:07:38 +0100 > Subject: Request for membership > From: readonegoke at gmail.com > To: sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org; samsongoddy at sugarlabs.org > > Hello, I am Otun Ridwan Adeola, i am a Nigerian and computer programmer. I > basically have knowledge in HTML5, CSS, bootstrap and java. I got a > referral from samson Goddy, and i would be glad and willing to contribute > to the open source program "sugar OS if my membership request is granted by > your worthy organization. > -- Gonzalo Odiard SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From activities at sugarlabs.org Wed Aug 5 10:46:27 2015 From: activities at sugarlabs.org (Sugar Labs Activities) Date: Wed, 5 Aug 2015 10:46:27 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Abacus-58 Message-ID: Activity Homepage: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/addon/4293 Sugar Platform: 0.96 - 0.104 Download Now: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29133/abacus-58.xo Release notes: 58 BUG FIX: Tch fixed a problem with the clipboard so now copying results to the Sugar clipboard works again. Sugar Labs Activities http://activities.sugarlabs.org From ignacio at sugarlabs.org Wed Aug 5 17:46:05 2015 From: ignacio at sugarlabs.org (=?UTF-8?Q?Ignacio_Rodr=C3=ADguez?=) Date: Wed, 5 Aug 2015 18:46:05 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN] Background selection in Journal Message-ID: Hi everyone. Finally I got time for start to work on the features/patches that I submitted time ago. (Too much time in school, but well, worth it :) ) In this case I would like to discuss the selection of background in Journal [1] patch (maybe it?s a Feature) The base idea is to add a option to the Copy to journal volume menu, for make it more easy for new users.. Also move code for background settings to jarabe.model, so the apps would be able to change the background (Not really needed in apps, but yes in this patch) Here [2] is a screenshot of how it looks XFCE have a option for set as wallpaper [3] I don't remember if gnome have one too Right now it copy the image to ?/home/user/Documents? for be able to see it in Control Panel, but Sam suggested to copy it to somewhere in ?/home/user/.sugar? folder. I like that idea, I think we can copy it to .sugar/background.[jpg/png] (Also we can copy the selected one in controlpanel for avoid problems if the user remove it in Journal - maybe another patch) Comments are gratefully received. [1] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/pull/466 [2] http://people.sugarlabs.org/ignacio/Set%20as%20wallpaper-Sugar.png [3] http://people.sugarlabs.org/ignacio/Set%20as%20wallpaper-XFCE.png Greetings, Ignacio Rodr?guez SugarLabs at Facebook -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sam at sam.today Wed Aug 5 18:04:31 2015 From: sam at sam.today (Sam P.) Date: Wed, 05 Aug 2015 22:04:31 +0000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN] Background selection in Journal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Ignacio, On Thu, 6 Aug 2015 7:46 am Ignacio Rodr?guez wrote: Hi everyone. Finally I got time for start to work on the features/patches that I submitted time ago. (Too much time in school, but well, worth it :) ) In this case I would like to discuss the selection of background in Journal [1] patch (maybe it?s a Feature) Does this have a feature page? The base idea is to add a option to the Copy to journal volume menu, for make it more easy for new users.. Also move code for background settings to jarabe.model, so the apps would be able to change the background (Not really needed in apps, but yes in this patch) Here [2] is a screenshot of how it looks Looks good. XFCE have a option for set as wallpaper [3] I don't remember if gnome have one too Right now it copy the image to ?/home/user/Documents? for be able to see it in Control Panel, but Sam suggested to copy it to somewhere in ?/home/user/.sugar? folder. I like that idea, I think we can copy it to .sugar/background.[jpg/png] (Also we can copy the selected one in controlpanel for avoid problems if the user remove it in Journal - maybe another patch) Maybe we could copy it to ".sugar/user-backgrounds" folder? Then we could just add that in the search path in the cpanel and not do to many fancy things? Maybe that is less code. Thanks, Sam Comments are gratefully received. [1] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/pull/466 [2] http://people.sugarlabs.org/ignacio/Set%20as%20wallpaper-Sugar.png [3] http://people.sugarlabs.org/ignacio/Set%20as%20wallpaper-XFCE.png Greetings, Ignacio Rodr?guez SugarLabs at Facebook _______________________________________________ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ignacio at sugarlabs.org Wed Aug 5 18:08:20 2015 From: ignacio at sugarlabs.org (=?UTF-8?Q?Ignacio_Rodr=C3=ADguez?=) Date: Wed, 5 Aug 2015 19:08:20 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN] Background selection in Journal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Sam :) Does this have a feature page? Not yet I will write one. Maybe we could copy it to ".sugar/user-backgrounds" folder? Sure > Then we could just add that in the search path in the cpanel and not do > to many fancy things? Maybe that is less code. I think we should set the background anyway when clicking -Copy to background- or maybe just remove the Copy to background, and add "Set as background/wallpaper" what do you think? Greetings, Ignacio Rodr?guez SugarLabs at Facebook 2015-08-05 19:04 GMT-03:00 Sam P. : > Hi Ignacio, > > On Thu, 6 Aug 2015 7:46 am Ignacio Rodr?guez > wrote: > > Hi everyone. > > Finally I got time for start to work on the features/patches that I > submitted time ago. (Too much time in school, but well, worth it :) ) > In this case I would like to discuss the selection of background in > Journal [1] patch (maybe it?s a Feature) > > Does this have a feature page? > > The base idea is to add a option to the Copy to journal volume menu, for > make it more easy for new users.. > > Also move code for background settings to jarabe.model, so the apps would > be able to change the background (Not really needed in apps, but yes in > this patch) > > Here [2] is a screenshot of how it > > looks > > Looks good. > > XFCE have a option for set as wallpaper [3] > > I don't remember if gnome have one too > > Right now it copy the image to ?/home/user/Documents? for be able to see > it in Control Panel, but Sam suggested to copy it to somewhere in > ?/home/user/.sugar? folder. > > I like that idea, I think we can copy it to .sugar/background.[jpg/png] > (Also we can copy the selected one in controlpanel for avoid problems if > the user remove it in Journal - maybe another patch) > > Maybe we could copy it to ".sugar/user-backgrounds" folder? Then we could > just add that in the search path in the cpanel and not do to many fancy > things? Maybe that is less code. > > Thanks, > Sam > > Comments are gratefully received. > > [1] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/pull/466 > [2] http://people.sugarlabs.org/ignacio/Set%20as%20wallpaper-Sugar.png > [3] http://people.sugarlabs.org/ignacio/Set%20as%20wallpaper-XFCE.png > > Greetings, > > Ignacio Rodr?guez > > SugarLabs at Facebook > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quozl at sugarlabs.org Wed Aug 5 19:38:44 2015 From: quozl at sugarlabs.org (James Cameron) Date: Thu, 6 Aug 2015 09:38:44 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN] Background selection in Journal In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20150805233844.GD7004@us.netrek.org> G'day, Thanks for asking. In 0.106 we have a background control panel which offers images from either the system or the documents path. So for the learner to use a photograph in the journal as background they must open the journal, locate the photograph, copy it to the documents directory, then switch to home view, and open the control panel, choose background, and then locate the photograph again, where it appears twice instead of once. I'd like to see "Use as background" in the journal, because it is a learner-desired method of a journal object, and the journal lists the objects. It will lower the barrier for learning and save time. At the moment, the journal object context menu has Resume, Resume with, Copy to, Duplicate, Send to, View Details, and Erase. I'd like to see "Use as background" in this menu, or in the "Copy to" submenu as you suggest. Also, after or in combination with the above, I'd like to see "Choose from journal" feature in the background control panel. It will be a redundant feature, providing an extra path to the same function. We already have several instances of redundant usage paths, and they serve a good purpose. I'd like to see either a button to press which opens the object picker, or the background control panel to show three groups of images; journal, documents, system. There is an opportunity to review common uses of the object picker to ensure they are all included in the journal object context menu. The other questions you ask are uninteresting implementation details unrelated to design: - whether it qualifies as a Feature in the release process, instead of a defect, (to my mind it is a defect, because you will have added nothing new to Sugar, only fixed a learner experience problem), - moving code around, - access to background model by activities, - whether to keep a redundant copy of the background separate to where it was chosen from. -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From godiard at sugarlabs.org Fri Aug 7 10:39:17 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Fri, 7 Aug 2015 11:39:17 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN] Background selection in Journal In-Reply-To: <20150805233844.GD7004@us.netrek.org> References: <20150805233844.GD7004@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: These are the reasons I would prefer add a option to get images from the Journal in the control panel, than add a option to set the image as background in the Journal Object palette: * Performance: create the Object palette is a relatively slow task. This feature add the need of check the mime type of the object, and is slow too. * Would be much easier to implement, and keep the background feature code contained. * The Journal code is already complex enough. * The actual implementation is a quick hack: in particular on this patch [1]: * Use get_uid_list_cb as a function to get the list of uid selected, and do not work in that way, think on multiple selections in the Journal. * Modify VolumeMenu adding a parameter to set if will set the background. Would be better create another class and keep the code separated. * The modifications on model.py need a deep review. But by example the destination_path is not returned for all the operations. If we land the replacement of the GtkMenu, then we would solve the performance part of the problem, because we delay the check of the mimetype until the Modal window is created. Would be good have a cleaner implementation anyway. [1] https://github.com/i5o/sugar/commit/d43c95d6b44e33d7cc2b71e7fd4e9cf7ad01b487 [2] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Replace_GtkMenu On Wed, Aug 5, 2015 at 8:38 PM, James Cameron wrote: > G'day, > > Thanks for asking. > > In 0.106 we have a background control panel which offers images from > either the system or the documents path. > > So for the learner to use a photograph in the journal as background > they must open the journal, locate the photograph, copy it to the > documents directory, then switch to home view, and open the control > panel, choose background, and then locate the photograph again, where > it appears twice instead of once. > > I'd like to see "Use as background" in the journal, because it is a > learner-desired method of a journal object, and the journal lists the > objects. It will lower the barrier for learning and save time. > > At the moment, the journal object context menu has Resume, Resume > with, Copy to, Duplicate, Send to, View Details, and Erase. > > I'd like to see "Use as background" in this menu, or in the "Copy to" > submenu as you suggest. > > Also, after or in combination with the above, I'd like to see "Choose > from journal" feature in the background control panel. It will be a > redundant feature, providing an extra path to the same function. We > already have several instances of redundant usage paths, and they > serve a good purpose. > > I'd like to see either a button to press which opens the object > picker, or the background control panel to show three groups of > images; journal, documents, system. > > There is an opportunity to review common uses of the object picker to > ensure they are all included in the journal object context menu. > > The other questions you ask are uninteresting implementation details > unrelated to design: > > - whether it qualifies as a Feature in the release process, instead of > a defect, (to my mind it is a defect, because you will have added > nothing new to Sugar, only fixed a learner experience problem), > > - moving code around, > > - access to background model by activities, > > - whether to keep a redundant copy of the background separate to where > it was chosen from. > > -- > James Cameron > http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -- Gonzalo Odiard SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From amitjha1412 at gmail.com Fri Aug 7 11:33:24 2015 From: amitjha1412 at gmail.com (Amit Kumar Jha) Date: Fri, 7 Aug 2015 21:03:24 +0530 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Unit Testing for Turtle Block Js Message-ID: I've tried to put down a list of tools, I think we should use for testing of TB. https://goo.gl/mhNGX4 I've tried it for a sample calculator app ( https://github.com/Amitjha1412/turtleblocksjs). If you could have a look at the doc and provide some suggestions, that would be really very helpful. :) -- Thanks, Amit Kumar Jha -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ignacio at sugarlabs.org Fri Aug 7 13:01:54 2015 From: ignacio at sugarlabs.org (=?UTF-8?Q?Ignacio_Rodr=C3=ADguez?=) Date: Fri, 7 Aug 2015 14:01:54 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN] Background selection in Journal In-Reply-To: References: <20150805233844.GD7004@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: Thanks for the comments Gonzalo I think all agree to get images from Journal in control panel So I will try to made it. About destination_path, was needed in case the image were copied to /home/user/Documents/lalala, but if we copy to a static path it wouldn't be needed So if we are going to replace GtkMenu would be better to don't touch the journal palette then. Thanks again, I will do some work, and send a new pr, for see what you guys, thinks. Greetings, Ignacio Rodr?guez SugarLabs at Facebook 2015-08-07 11:39 GMT-03:00 Gonzalo Odiard : > These are the reasons I would prefer add a option to get images from the > Journal in the control panel, > than add a option to set the image as background in the Journal Object > palette: > * Performance: create the Object palette is a relatively slow task. This > feature add the need of check > the mime type of the object, and is slow too. > * Would be much easier to implement, and keep the background feature code > contained. > * The Journal code is already complex enough. > * The actual implementation is a quick hack: in particular on this patch > [1]: > * Use get_uid_list_cb as a function to get the list of uid selected, and > do not work in that way, > think on multiple selections in the Journal. > * Modify VolumeMenu adding a parameter to set if will set the > background. Would be better > create another class and keep the code separated. > * The modifications on model.py need a deep review. But by example the > destination_path > is not returned for all the operations. > > If we land the replacement of the GtkMenu, then we would solve the > performance part of the problem, > because we delay the check of the mimetype until the Modal window is > created. > Would be good have a cleaner implementation anyway. > > [1] > https://github.com/i5o/sugar/commit/d43c95d6b44e33d7cc2b71e7fd4e9cf7ad01b487 > > [2] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Replace_GtkMenu > > On Wed, Aug 5, 2015 at 8:38 PM, James Cameron wrote: > >> G'day, >> >> Thanks for asking. >> >> In 0.106 we have a background control panel which offers images from >> either the system or the documents path. >> >> So for the learner to use a photograph in the journal as background >> they must open the journal, locate the photograph, copy it to the >> documents directory, then switch to home view, and open the control >> panel, choose background, and then locate the photograph again, where >> it appears twice instead of once. >> >> I'd like to see "Use as background" in the journal, because it is a >> learner-desired method of a journal object, and the journal lists the >> objects. It will lower the barrier for learning and save time. >> >> At the moment, the journal object context menu has Resume, Resume >> with, Copy to, Duplicate, Send to, View Details, and Erase. >> >> I'd like to see "Use as background" in this menu, or in the "Copy to" >> submenu as you suggest. >> >> Also, after or in combination with the above, I'd like to see "Choose >> from journal" feature in the background control panel. It will be a >> redundant feature, providing an extra path to the same function. We >> already have several instances of redundant usage paths, and they >> serve a good purpose. >> >> I'd like to see either a button to press which opens the object >> picker, or the background control panel to show three groups of >> images; journal, documents, system. >> >> There is an opportunity to review common uses of the object picker to >> ensure they are all included in the journal object context menu. >> >> The other questions you ask are uninteresting implementation details >> unrelated to design: >> >> - whether it qualifies as a Feature in the release process, instead of >> a defect, (to my mind it is a defect, because you will have added >> nothing new to Sugar, only fixed a learner experience problem), >> >> - moving code around, >> >> - access to background model by activities, >> >> - whether to keep a redundant copy of the background separate to where >> it was chosen from. >> >> -- >> James Cameron >> http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> > > > > -- > Gonzalo Odiard > > SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From activities at sugarlabs.org Fri Aug 7 14:06:09 2015 From: activities at sugarlabs.org (Sugar Labs Activities) Date: Fri, 7 Aug 2015 14:06:09 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Finance-13 Message-ID: <5862468735bafa4216cfa9b6c5be0143@activities.sugarlabs.org> Activity Homepage: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/addon/4040 Sugar Platform: 0.96 - 0.104 Download Now: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29134/finance-13.xo Release notes: Setup header controls also for empty panel (Martin Abente) Sugar Labs Activities http://activities.sugarlabs.org From activities at sugarlabs.org Mon Aug 10 10:43:12 2015 From: activities at sugarlabs.org (Sugar Labs Activities) Date: Mon, 10 Aug 2015 10:43:12 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Paint-65 Message-ID: <1f6a39948e6fe12d24c69424d36e21cd@activities.sugarlabs.org> Activity Homepage: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/addon/4082 Sugar Platform: 0.96 - 0.104 Download Now: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29135/paint-65.xo Release notes: Avoid possible wrong state on load stamp (Martin Abente) Sugar Labs Activities http://activities.sugarlabs.org From activities at sugarlabs.org Mon Aug 10 10:49:41 2015 From: activities at sugarlabs.org (Sugar Labs Activities) Date: Mon, 10 Aug 2015 10:49:41 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Read-117 Message-ID: Activity Homepage: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/addon/4028 Sugar Platform: 0.96 - 0.104 Download Now: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29136/read-117.xo Release notes: Fix clipboard bug (Martin Abente) Sugar Labs Activities http://activities.sugarlabs.org From godiard at sugarlabs.org Mon Aug 10 10:58:18 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Mon, 10 Aug 2015 11:58:18 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Paint-65 In-Reply-To: <1f6a39948e6fe12d24c69424d36e21cd@activities.sugarlabs.org> References: <1f6a39948e6fe12d24c69424d36e21cd@activities.sugarlabs.org> Message-ID: I forgotten include the following credits in the release notes: * Use RadioToolButtons for Kalidoscpoe and ranibow tool - fixes empty palette (Sam Parkinson) * Force rotate icons to use sugar style (Sam Parkinson) * Use Kaleidoscope instead of Kalidoscope in tooltip (Ignacio Rodriguez) On Mon, Aug 10, 2015 at 11:43 AM, Sugar Labs Activities < activities at sugarlabs.org> wrote: > Activity Homepage: > http://activities.sugarlabs.org/addon/4082 > > Sugar Platform: > 0.96 - 0.104 > > Download Now: > http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29135/paint-65.xo > > Release notes: > Avoid possible wrong state on load stamp (Martin Abente) > > > Sugar Labs Activities > http://activities.sugarlabs.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -- Gonzalo Odiard SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From walter.bender at gmail.com Mon Aug 10 11:52:19 2015 From: walter.bender at gmail.com (Walter Bender) Date: Mon, 10 Aug 2015 11:52:19 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [SLOB] meeting reminder Message-ID: We meet today at 24:00 (UTC); 20:00 (BOSTON, ASUNCION); 10:00+1 (SIDNEY); 21:00 (MONTEVIDEO, BUENOS AIRES), 19:00 (BOGOTA); 18:00 (MANAGUA) To discuss, among other topics: * board election * liaison to SFC * website Looking forward to seeing you these. regards. -walter -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org From samsongoddy at hotmail.com Mon Aug 10 13:41:14 2015 From: samsongoddy at hotmail.com (samson goddy) Date: Mon, 10 Aug 2015 18:41:14 +0100 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [SLOB] meeting reminder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I can't make it due to my time But i will view the logs tomorrow. > Date: Mon, 10 Aug 2015 11:52:19 -0400 > From: walter.bender at gmail.com > To: slobs at lists.sugarlabs.org > CC: iaep at lists.sugarlabs.org; sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org; olpc-sur at lists.laptop.org > Subject: [Sugar-devel] [SLOB] meeting reminder > > We meet today at 24:00 (UTC); 20:00 (BOSTON, ASUNCION); 10:00+1 > (SIDNEY); 21:00 (MONTEVIDEO, BUENOS AIRES), 19:00 (BOGOTA); 18:00 > (MANAGUA) > > To discuss, among other topics: > * board election > * liaison to SFC > * website > > Looking forward to seeing you these. > > regards. > > -walter > > -- > Walter Bender > Sugar Labs > http://www.sugarlabs.org > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quozl at laptop.org Mon Aug 10 21:31:28 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Tue, 11 Aug 2015 11:31:28 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] [SLOB] meeting reminder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20150811013128.GC5478@us.netrek.org> Thanks, I enjoyed observing this meeting. -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From walter.bender at gmail.com Mon Aug 10 21:34:12 2015 From: walter.bender at gmail.com (Walter Bender) Date: Mon, 10 Aug 2015 21:34:12 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] [SLOB] meeting reminder In-Reply-To: <20150811013128.GC5478@us.netrek.org> References: <20150811013128.GC5478@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: On Mon, Aug 10, 2015 at 9:31 PM, James Cameron wrote: > Thanks, I enjoyed observing this meeting. We aim to please :) Hopefully you enjoyed it enough to consider running for a board position :) > > -- > James Cameron > http://quozl.linux.org.au/ -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org From activities at sugarlabs.org Tue Aug 11 15:52:16 2015 From: activities at sugarlabs.org (Sugar Labs Activities) Date: Tue, 11 Aug 2015 15:52:16 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release XO Help-20 Message-ID: Activity Homepage: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/addon/4051 Sugar Platform: 0.96 - 0.104 Download Now: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29137/help-20.xo Release notes: New IRC activity page (Daksh Shah) Calculate functions added to the activity page (Vikram Ahuja) Multiple fixes from (Iain Brown Douglas) Add a script to initialize translations using Google Translate (Gonzalo Odiard) Translate all the pages to Spanish (Gonzalo Odiard & Mariel Odiard) THIS IS THE FIRST VERSION OF HELP ACTIVITY WITH THE PAGES ON ENGLISH AND SPANISH Fix typo on uri rewrite (Gonzalo Odiard) Sugar Labs Activities http://activities.sugarlabs.org From tony_anderson at usa.net Wed Aug 12 06:55:25 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 12:55:25 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support Message-ID: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it is to switch languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long list of supported languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the order you prefer'. So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English USA + - In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that English USA. However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button to the left of the word English. This opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' button at least in my case led to confusion. Tony From tony_anderson at usa.net Wed Aug 12 07:26:29 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 13:26:29 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> Message-ID: <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> Hi, To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the button to the left of the language (English) to get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or region?). You click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the top right button to restart as always. After restarting the added language (German) is the system language. However, when going back to the language selection in settings, German is the only language shown. So you need to click to open the language list, click on English. This opens up the options of Australien and USA. Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German option has disappeared. I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. That list is in English. I selected Egypt and was able to switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to the left of Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is evidently shown in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. I selected USA and switched the system to Spanish. I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in Spanish (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original English, USA option. Tony On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: > I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it > is to switch > languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. > > In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long > list of supported > languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the order > you prefer'. > So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English USA + - > > In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that > English USA. > > However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button to the > left of the word English. This > opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: > Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... > > Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' button at > least in my case led to confusion. > > Tony > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > . > From sam at sam.today Wed Aug 12 07:38:45 2015 From: sam at sam.today (Sam P.) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 11:38:45 +0000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> Message-ID: Hi Tony, The control panel is very simple. The left column is the language and the right column is the region/dialect. Maybe that should be a column header? Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons. The dropdown for the language selectors in a up or down arrow, while the add a new language button is a "+". The hitbox for the expand/contract the dropdown includes the button and the label, making it more discoverable. Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) to be more consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui considering it does a very complex job. I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image that you are running, can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're describing. Please consider opening separate tickets for the issues. Thanks, Sam On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson wrote: > Hi, > > To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the button to the > left of the language (English) to > get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or region?). You > click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the > + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the top right > button to restart as always. > > After restarting the added language (German) is the system language. > However, when going back to the > language selection in settings, German is the only language shown. So > you need to click to open the language > list, click on English. This opens up the options of Australien and USA. > Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German > option has disappeared. > > I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. That list is > in English. I selected Egypt and was able to > switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to the left of > Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages > in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is evidently shown > in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected > Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. I selected > USA and switched the system to Spanish. > > I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in Spanish > (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice > of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original English, > USA option. > > Tony > > > On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: > > I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it > > is to switch > > languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. > > > > In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long > > list of supported > > languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the order > > you prefer'. > > So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English USA + - > > > > In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that > > English USA. > > > > However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button to the > > left of the word English. This > > opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: > > Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... > > > > Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' button at > > least in my case led to confusion. > > > > Tony > > _______________________________________________ > > Sugar-devel mailing list > > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > . > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tony_anderson at usa.net Wed Aug 12 07:50:52 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 13:50:52 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> Message-ID: <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> Hi, Sam My concern is not the execution of the panel, but how we explain it to users. Remember our target audience is teachers and students in primary school in the developing world with little or no prior computer experience. As developers, we often see things as simple because we have used many others like it. It may not be so simple to those who do not have that experience. However, we probably should think about the dialect/region selection. If I have selected Arabic, perhaps the dialect/region list should be in Arabic. We may also want to think about that list - do the entries represent countries where the language is spoken or represent dialects? I suspect the lists were copied from earlier releases. Tony On 08/12/2015 01:38 PM, Sam P. wrote: > Hi Tony, > > The control panel is very simple. The left column is the language and > the right column is the region/dialect. > > Maybe that should be a column header? > > Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons. The dropdown for > the language selectors in a up or down arrow, while the add a new > language button is a "+". The hitbox for the expand/contract the > dropdown includes the button and the label, making it more discoverable. > > Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) to be more > consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui considering it does a > very complex job. > > I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image that you are > running, can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're > describing. > > Please consider opening separate tickets for the issues. > > Thanks, > Sam > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson > wrote: > > Hi, > > To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the button > to the > left of the language (English) to > get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or > region?). You > click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the > + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the top right > button to restart as always. > > After restarting the added language (German) is the system language. > However, when going back to the > language selection in settings, German is the only language shown. So > you need to click to open the language > list, click on English. This opens up the options of Australien > and USA. > Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German > option has disappeared. > > I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. That > list is > in English. I selected Egypt and was able to > switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to the > left of > Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages > in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is evidently shown > in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected > Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. I > selected > USA and switched the system to Spanish. > > I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in Spanish > (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice > of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original English, > USA option. > > Tony > > > On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: > > I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it > > is to switch > > languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. > > > > In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long > > list of supported > > languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the > order > > you prefer'. > > So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English > USA + - > > > > In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that > > English USA. > > > > However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button > to the > > left of the word English. This > > opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: > > Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... > > > > Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' > button at > > least in my case led to confusion. > > > > Tony > > _______________________________________________ > > Sugar-devel mailing list > > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > . > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sam at sam.today Wed Aug 12 07:56:30 2015 From: sam at sam.today (Sam P.) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 11:56:30 +0000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> Message-ID: Hey Tony, On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:51 PM Tony Anderson wrote: > Hi, Sam > > My concern is not the execution of the panel, but how we explain it to > users. Remember our target audience is teachers and students in primary > school in the > developing world with little or no prior computer experience. As > developers, we often see things as simple because we have used many others > like it. It may not > be so simple to those who do not have that experience. > Yep. But we don't have a selector in the intro, so they'd be pretty amazing to find the language settings if it wasn't configured by their deployment :) > > However, we probably should think about the dialect/region selection. If I > have selected Arabic, perhaps the dialect/region list should be in Arabic. > Ticket: https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4449 > > We may also want to think about that list - do the entries represent > countries where the language is spoken or represent dialects? I suspect the > lists were > copied from earlier releases. > They're just the system languages, so that is an issue for the distribution. > > > Tony > > > On 08/12/2015 01:38 PM, Sam P. wrote: > > Hi Tony, > > The control panel is very simple. The left column is the language and the > right column is the region/dialect. > > Maybe that should be a column header? > > Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons. The dropdown for the > language selectors in a up or down arrow, while the add a new language > button is a "+". The hitbox for the expand/contract the dropdown includes > the button and the label, making it more discoverable. > > Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) to be more > consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui considering it does a very > complex job. > > I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image that you are running, > can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're describing. > > Please consider opening separate tickets for the issues. > > Thanks, > Sam > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson > wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the button to the >> left of the language (English) to >> get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or region?). You >> click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the >> + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the top right >> button to restart as always. >> >> After restarting the added language (German) is the system language. >> However, when going back to the >> language selection in settings, German is the only language shown. So >> you need to click to open the language >> list, click on English. This opens up the options of Australien and USA. >> Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German >> option has disappeared. >> >> I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. That list is >> in English. I selected Egypt and was able to >> switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to the left of >> Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages >> in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is evidently shown >> in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected >> Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. I selected >> USA and switched the system to Spanish. >> >> I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in Spanish >> (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice >> of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original English, >> USA option. >> >> Tony >> >> >> On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: >> > I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it >> > is to switch >> > languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. >> > >> > In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long >> > list of supported >> > languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the order >> > you prefer'. >> > So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English USA + - >> > >> > In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that >> > English USA. >> > >> > However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button to the >> > left of the word English. This >> > opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: >> > Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... >> > >> > Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' button at >> > least in my case led to confusion. >> > >> > Tony >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Sugar-devel mailing list >> > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> > . >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From walter.bender at gmail.com Wed Aug 12 08:57:17 2015 From: walter.bender at gmail.com (Walter Bender) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 08:57:17 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> Message-ID: On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 7:56 AM, Sam P. wrote: > Hey Tony, > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:51 PM Tony Anderson wrote: >> >> Hi, Sam >> >> My concern is not the execution of the panel, but how we explain it to >> users. Remember our target audience is teachers and students in primary >> school in the >> developing world with little or no prior computer experience. As >> developers, we often see things as simple because we have used many others >> like it. It may not >> be so simple to those who do not have that experience. > > > Yep. But we don't have a selector in the intro, so they'd be pretty amazing > to find the language settings if it wasn't configured by their deployment :) > >> >> >> However, we probably should think about the dialect/region selection. If I >> have selected Arabic, perhaps the dialect/region list should be in Arabic. > > > Ticket: https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4449 Makes sense. I will investigate as I am the guilty party here. > >> >> >> We may also want to think about that list - do the entries represent >> countries where the language is spoken or represent dialects? I suspect the >> lists were >> copied from earlier releases. > > > They're just the system languages, so that is an issue for the distribution. > >> >> >> >> Tony >> >> >> On 08/12/2015 01:38 PM, Sam P. wrote: >> >> Hi Tony, >> >> The control panel is very simple. The left column is the language and the >> right column is the region/dialect. >> >> Maybe that should be a column header? >> >> Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons. The dropdown for the >> language selectors in a up or down arrow, while the add a new language >> button is a "+". The hitbox for the expand/contract the dropdown includes >> the button and the label, making it more discoverable. >> >> Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) to be more >> consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui considering it does a very >> complex job. >> >> I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image that you are running, >> can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're describing. >> >> Please consider opening separate tickets for the issues. >> >> Thanks, >> Sam >> >> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the button to the >>> left of the language (English) to >>> get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or region?). You >>> click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the >>> + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the top right >>> button to restart as always. >>> >>> After restarting the added language (German) is the system language. >>> However, when going back to the >>> language selection in settings, German is the only language shown. So >>> you need to click to open the language >>> list, click on English. This opens up the options of Australien and USA. >>> Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German >>> option has disappeared. >>> >>> I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. That list is >>> in English. I selected Egypt and was able to >>> switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to the left of >>> Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages >>> in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is evidently shown >>> in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected >>> Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. I selected >>> USA and switched the system to Spanish. >>> >>> I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in Spanish >>> (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice >>> of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original English, >>> USA option. >>> >>> Tony >>> >>> >>> On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: >>> > I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it >>> > is to switch >>> > languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. >>> > >>> > In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long >>> > list of supported >>> > languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the order >>> > you prefer'. >>> > So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English USA + - >>> > >>> > In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that >>> > English USA. >>> > >>> > However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button to the >>> > left of the word English. This >>> > opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: >>> > Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... >>> > >>> > Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' button at >>> > least in my case led to confusion. >>> > >>> > Tony >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Sugar-devel mailing list >>> > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>> > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>> > . >>> > >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org From tony_anderson at usa.net Wed Aug 12 09:13:14 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 15:13:14 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> Message-ID: <55CB466A.2050501@usa.net> Hi, Sam In Rwanda, the students found the language panel (after all, they are supposed to try everything) and switched their system to Arabic, probably because it looked interesting and was at the top of the list. However, finding a teacher able to switch back to English was a bit trickier. Actually, I think the developers haven't really thought through the deployment process. The computers are typically batch flashed before being assigned to students. So the setting of nickname, color and now gender and grade level can't be done at that time. So in our workshops, we need to explain to the teachers how to provide (or have the children provide) the correct information through settings. Despite being one laptop per child, in reality many deployments share one laptop among several students (e.g. class 4 in this hour and class 5 in the next hour). As a consequence, the statistics gathered by these settings are really not accurate. Several schools set the nick to a local id number which is also written on the XO. This ID is how students identify which one is theirs in the charging rack. So designing a specific interaction on the basis that it will be done by an experienced computer user and that others will be done by students and teachers is difficult. Tony On 08/12/2015 01:56 PM, Sam P. wrote: > Hey Tony, > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:51 PM Tony Anderson > wrote: > > Hi, Sam > > My concern is not the execution of the panel, but how we explain > it to users. Remember our target audience is teachers and students > in primary school in the > developing world with little or no prior computer experience. As > developers, we often see things as simple because we have used > many others like it. It may not > be so simple to those who do not have that experience. > > > Yep. But we don't have a selector in the intro, so they'd be pretty > amazing to find the language settings if it wasn't configured by their > deployment :) > > > However, we probably should think about the dialect/region > selection. If I have selected Arabic, perhaps the dialect/region > list should be in Arabic. > > > Ticket: https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4449 > > > We may also want to think about that list - do the entries > represent countries where the language is spoken or represent > dialects? I suspect the lists were > copied from earlier releases. > > > They're just the system languages, so that is an issue for the > distribution. > > > > Tony > > > On 08/12/2015 01:38 PM, Sam P. wrote: >> Hi Tony, >> >> The control panel is very simple. The left column is the >> language and the right column is the region/dialect. >> >> Maybe that should be a column header? >> >> Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons. The >> dropdown for the language selectors in a up or down arrow, while >> the add a new language button is a "+". The hitbox for the >> expand/contract the dropdown includes the button and the label, >> making it more discoverable. >> >> Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) to be more >> consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui considering it does >> a very complex job. >> >> I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image that you are >> running, can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're >> describing. >> >> Please consider opening separate tickets for the issues. >> >> Thanks, >> Sam >> >> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson >> > wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the >> button to the >> left of the language (English) to >> get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or >> region?). You >> click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the >> + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the >> top right >> button to restart as always. >> >> After restarting the added language (German) is the system >> language. >> However, when going back to the >> language selection in settings, German is the only language >> shown. So >> you need to click to open the language >> list, click on English. This opens up the options of >> Australien and USA. >> Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German >> option has disappeared. >> >> I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. >> That list is >> in English. I selected Egypt and was able to >> switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to >> the left of >> Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages >> in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is >> evidently shown >> in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected >> Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. >> I selected >> USA and switched the system to Spanish. >> >> I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in >> Spanish >> (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice >> of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original >> English, >> USA option. >> >> Tony >> >> >> On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: >> > I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show >> how easy it >> > is to switch >> > languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. >> > >> > In previous versions, you go to settings and language and >> get a long >> > list of supported >> > languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages >> in the order >> > you prefer'. >> > So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: >> English USA + - >> > >> > In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other >> language that >> > English USA. >> > >> > However, today I found that the trick is to click on the >> button to the >> > left of the word English. This >> > opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with >> dialects: >> > Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... >> > >> > Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a >> '+' button at >> > least in my case led to confusion. >> > >> > Tony >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Sugar-devel mailing list >> > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> >> > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> > . >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tony_anderson at usa.net Wed Aug 12 09:22:37 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 15:22:37 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speak Activity Message-ID: <55CB489D.8030300@usa.net> Hi, Gonzalo I am getting involved in a new deployment which needs Arabic support. So I was trying to describe what is available and what may need some work. I wanted to point to the Speak activity but first wanted to check if Arabic is one of the languages. I was a bit surprised to find that language selection is not in version 51 (13.2.5). The help activity still shows it in the screen-shot. Tony From walter.bender at gmail.com Wed Aug 12 09:34:15 2015 From: walter.bender at gmail.com (Walter Bender) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 09:34:15 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: <55CB466A.2050501@usa.net> References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> <55CB466A.2050501@usa.net> Message-ID: On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:13 AM, Tony Anderson wrote: > Hi, Sam > > In Rwanda, the students found the language panel (after all, they are > supposed to try everything) and switched their system to Arabic, probably > because it looked interesting and was at the top of the list. However, > finding a teacher able to switch back to English was a bit trickier. > > Actually, I think the developers haven't really thought through the > deployment process. The computers are typically batch flashed before being > assigned to students. > So the setting of nickname, color and now gender and grade level can't be > done at that time. So in our workshops, we need to explain to the teachers > how to > provide (or have the children provide) the correct information through > settings. Despite being one laptop per child, in reality many deployments > share one laptop > among several students (e.g. class 4 in this hour and class 5 in the next > hour). As a consequence, the statistics gathered by these settings are > really not accurate. Not sure what you mean bu accurate, but clearly under these circumstances the stats package that Martin developed would apply to groups of students rather than individual students. It could still inform us regarding what apps are used in the aggregate. > Several schools set the nick to a local id number which is also written on > the XO. This ID is how students identify which one is theirs in the charging > rack. > > So designing a specific interaction on the basis that it will be done by an > experienced computer user and that others will be done by students and > teachers is difficult. It is inevitable that some laptops are going to have the language set to a language which makes settings difficult to manage. Maybe we should have some way to resetting to the language in which the laptop was originally flashed -- a single button click on the language control panel section? This will require our keeping track of the initial language, something we don't currently track in Sugar. Thoughts on this? > > Tony > > > On 08/12/2015 01:56 PM, Sam P. wrote: > > Hey Tony, > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:51 PM Tony Anderson wrote: >> >> Hi, Sam >> >> My concern is not the execution of the panel, but how we explain it to >> users. Remember our target audience is teachers and students in primary >> school in the >> developing world with little or no prior computer experience. As >> developers, we often see things as simple because we have used many others >> like it. It may not >> be so simple to those who do not have that experience. > > > Yep. But we don't have a selector in the intro, so they'd be pretty amazing > to find the language settings if it wasn't configured by their deployment :) > >> >> >> However, we probably should think about the dialect/region selection. If I >> have selected Arabic, perhaps the dialect/region list should be in Arabic. > > > Ticket: https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4449 > >> >> >> We may also want to think about that list - do the entries represent >> countries where the language is spoken or represent dialects? I suspect the >> lists were >> copied from earlier releases. > > > They're just the system languages, so that is an issue for the distribution. > >> >> >> >> Tony >> >> >> On 08/12/2015 01:38 PM, Sam P. wrote: >> >> Hi Tony, >> >> The control panel is very simple. The left column is the language and the >> right column is the region/dialect. >> >> Maybe that should be a column header? >> >> Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons. The dropdown for the >> language selectors in a up or down arrow, while the add a new language >> button is a "+". The hitbox for the expand/contract the dropdown includes >> the button and the label, making it more discoverable. >> >> Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) to be more >> consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui considering it does a very >> complex job. >> >> I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image that you are running, >> can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're describing. >> >> Please consider opening separate tickets for the issues. >> >> Thanks, >> Sam >> >> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the button to the >>> left of the language (English) to >>> get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or region?). You >>> click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the >>> + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the top right >>> button to restart as always. >>> >>> After restarting the added language (German) is the system language. >>> However, when going back to the >>> language selection in settings, German is the only language shown. So >>> you need to click to open the language >>> list, click on English. This opens up the options of Australien and USA. >>> Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German >>> option has disappeared. >>> >>> I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. That list is >>> in English. I selected Egypt and was able to >>> switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to the left of >>> Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages >>> in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is evidently shown >>> in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected >>> Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. I selected >>> USA and switched the system to Spanish. >>> >>> I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in Spanish >>> (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice >>> of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original English, >>> USA option. >>> >>> Tony >>> >>> >>> On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: >>> > I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it >>> > is to switch >>> > languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. >>> > >>> > In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long >>> > list of supported >>> > languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the order >>> > you prefer'. >>> > So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English USA + - >>> > >>> > In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that >>> > English USA. >>> > >>> > However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button to the >>> > left of the word English. This >>> > opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: >>> > Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... >>> > >>> > Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' button at >>> > least in my case led to confusion. >>> > >>> > Tony >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Sugar-devel mailing list >>> > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>> > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>> > . >>> > >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org From walter.bender at gmail.com Wed Aug 12 09:40:04 2015 From: walter.bender at gmail.com (Walter Bender) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 09:40:04 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speak Activity In-Reply-To: <55CB489D.8030300@usa.net> References: <55CB489D.8030300@usa.net> Message-ID: On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:22 AM, Tony Anderson wrote: > Hi, Gonzalo > > I am getting involved in a new deployment which needs Arabic support. So I > was trying to describe what is available and what may need some work. I > wanted > to point to the Speak activity but first wanted to check if Arabic is one of > the languages. I was a bit surprised to find that language selection is not > in > version 51 (13.2.5). The help activity still shows it in the screen-shot. It is still there, just under the voice attributes toolbar instead of on the main toolbar. See attached. regards. -walter > > Tony > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Screenshot of _Speak Activity_.png Type: image/png Size: 13105 bytes Desc: not available URL: From tony_anderson at usa.net Wed Aug 12 09:55:21 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 15:55:21 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> <55CB466A.2050501@usa.net> Message-ID: <55CB5049.2080608@usa.net> Hi, Walter When I saw the language panel, I thought it was trying to work like the Mate keyboard panel. You start with a default. You add options. Then you use the panel to select an option. Such an approach would make it easy to 'get out of' a wrong selection. Tony On 08/12/2015 03:34 PM, Walter Bender wrote: > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:13 AM, Tony Anderson wrote: >> Hi, Sam >> >> In Rwanda, the students found the language panel (after all, they are >> supposed to try everything) and switched their system to Arabic, probably >> because it looked interesting and was at the top of the list. However, >> finding a teacher able to switch back to English was a bit trickier. >> >> Actually, I think the developers haven't really thought through the >> deployment process. The computers are typically batch flashed before being >> assigned to students. >> So the setting of nickname, color and now gender and grade level can't be >> done at that time. So in our workshops, we need to explain to the teachers >> how to >> provide (or have the children provide) the correct information through >> settings. Despite being one laptop per child, in reality many deployments >> share one laptop >> among several students (e.g. class 4 in this hour and class 5 in the next >> hour). As a consequence, the statistics gathered by these settings are >> really not accurate. > Not sure what you mean bu accurate, but clearly under these > circumstances the stats package that Martin developed would apply to > groups of students rather than individual students. It could still > inform us regarding what apps are used in the aggregate. > >> Several schools set the nick to a local id number which is also written on >> the XO. This ID is how students identify which one is theirs in the charging >> rack. >> >> So designing a specific interaction on the basis that it will be done by an >> experienced computer user and that others will be done by students and >> teachers is difficult. > It is inevitable that some laptops are going to have the language set > to a language which makes settings difficult to manage. Maybe we > should have some way to resetting to the language in which the laptop > was originally flashed -- a single button click on the language > control panel section? This will require our keeping track of the > initial language, something we don't currently track in Sugar. > Thoughts on this? > >> Tony >> >> >> On 08/12/2015 01:56 PM, Sam P. wrote: >> >> Hey Tony, >> >> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:51 PM Tony Anderson wrote: >>> Hi, Sam >>> >>> My concern is not the execution of the panel, but how we explain it to >>> users. Remember our target audience is teachers and students in primary >>> school in the >>> developing world with little or no prior computer experience. As >>> developers, we often see things as simple because we have used many others >>> like it. It may not >>> be so simple to those who do not have that experience. >> >> Yep. But we don't have a selector in the intro, so they'd be pretty amazing >> to find the language settings if it wasn't configured by their deployment :) >> >>> >>> However, we probably should think about the dialect/region selection. If I >>> have selected Arabic, perhaps the dialect/region list should be in Arabic. >> >> Ticket: https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4449 >> >>> >>> We may also want to think about that list - do the entries represent >>> countries where the language is spoken or represent dialects? I suspect the >>> lists were >>> copied from earlier releases. >> >> They're just the system languages, so that is an issue for the distribution. >> >>> >>> >>> Tony >>> >>> >>> On 08/12/2015 01:38 PM, Sam P. wrote: >>> >>> Hi Tony, >>> >>> The control panel is very simple. The left column is the language and the >>> right column is the region/dialect. >>> >>> Maybe that should be a column header? >>> >>> Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons. The dropdown for the >>> language selectors in a up or down arrow, while the add a new language >>> button is a "+". The hitbox for the expand/contract the dropdown includes >>> the button and the label, making it more discoverable. >>> >>> Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) to be more >>> consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui considering it does a very >>> complex job. >>> >>> I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image that you are running, >>> can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're describing. >>> >>> Please consider opening separate tickets for the issues. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Sam >>> >>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson >>> wrote: >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the button to the >>>> left of the language (English) to >>>> get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or region?). You >>>> click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the >>>> + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the top right >>>> button to restart as always. >>>> >>>> After restarting the added language (German) is the system language. >>>> However, when going back to the >>>> language selection in settings, German is the only language shown. So >>>> you need to click to open the language >>>> list, click on English. This opens up the options of Australien and USA. >>>> Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German >>>> option has disappeared. >>>> >>>> I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. That list is >>>> in English. I selected Egypt and was able to >>>> switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to the left of >>>> Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages >>>> in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is evidently shown >>>> in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected >>>> Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. I selected >>>> USA and switched the system to Spanish. >>>> >>>> I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in Spanish >>>> (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice >>>> of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original English, >>>> USA option. >>>> >>>> Tony >>>> >>>> >>>> On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: >>>>> I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it >>>>> is to switch >>>>> languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. >>>>> >>>>> In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long >>>>> list of supported >>>>> languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the order >>>>> you prefer'. >>>>> So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English USA + - >>>>> >>>>> In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that >>>>> English USA. >>>>> >>>>> However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button to the >>>>> left of the word English. This >>>>> opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: >>>>> Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... >>>>> >>>>> Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' button at >>>>> least in my case led to confusion. >>>>> >>>>> Tony >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> . >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> > > From tony_anderson at usa.net Wed Aug 12 09:59:58 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 15:59:58 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speak Activity In-Reply-To: References: <55CB489D.8030300@usa.net> Message-ID: <55CB515E.2030403@usa.net> Hi, Walter Thanks. Sadly, that shows we don't have Arabic support in Speak. Perhaps the Help description on Speak should be updated. Tony On 08/12/2015 03:40 PM, Walter Bender wrote: > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:22 AM, Tony Anderson wrote: >> Hi, Gonzalo >> >> I am getting involved in a new deployment which needs Arabic support. So I >> was trying to describe what is available and what may need some work. I >> wanted >> to point to the Speak activity but first wanted to check if Arabic is one of >> the languages. I was a bit surprised to find that language selection is not >> in >> version 51 (13.2.5). The help activity still shows it in the screen-shot. > It is still there, just under the voice attributes toolbar instead of > on the main toolbar. See attached. > > regards. > > -walter >> Tony >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From walter.bender at gmail.com Wed Aug 12 10:02:35 2015 From: walter.bender at gmail.com (Walter Bender) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 10:02:35 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: <55CB5049.2080608@usa.net> References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> <55CB466A.2050501@usa.net> <55CB5049.2080608@usa.net> Message-ID: On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:55 AM, Tony Anderson wrote: > Hi, Walter > > When I saw the language panel, I thought it was trying to work like the Mate > keyboard panel. You start with a default. You > add options. Then you use the panel to select an option. Such an approach > would make it easy to 'get out of' a wrong selection. I don't think the two are analogous. While you can add language options, the typical use is to select the default language, which will override the UI after restart. Open to suggestions, but I think a reset button that is always in the initial language may be a decent solution. -walter > > Tony > > > > On 08/12/2015 03:34 PM, Walter Bender wrote: >> >> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:13 AM, Tony Anderson >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, Sam >>> >>> In Rwanda, the students found the language panel (after all, they are >>> supposed to try everything) and switched their system to Arabic, probably >>> because it looked interesting and was at the top of the list. However, >>> finding a teacher able to switch back to English was a bit trickier. >>> >>> Actually, I think the developers haven't really thought through the >>> deployment process. The computers are typically batch flashed before >>> being >>> assigned to students. >>> So the setting of nickname, color and now gender and grade level can't be >>> done at that time. So in our workshops, we need to explain to the >>> teachers >>> how to >>> provide (or have the children provide) the correct information through >>> settings. Despite being one laptop per child, in reality many deployments >>> share one laptop >>> among several students (e.g. class 4 in this hour and class 5 in the next >>> hour). As a consequence, the statistics gathered by these settings are >>> really not accurate. >> >> Not sure what you mean bu accurate, but clearly under these >> circumstances the stats package that Martin developed would apply to >> groups of students rather than individual students. It could still >> inform us regarding what apps are used in the aggregate. >> >>> Several schools set the nick to a local id number which is also written >>> on >>> the XO. This ID is how students identify which one is theirs in the >>> charging >>> rack. >>> >>> So designing a specific interaction on the basis that it will be done by >>> an >>> experienced computer user and that others will be done by students and >>> teachers is difficult. >> >> It is inevitable that some laptops are going to have the language set >> to a language which makes settings difficult to manage. Maybe we >> should have some way to resetting to the language in which the laptop >> was originally flashed -- a single button click on the language >> control panel section? This will require our keeping track of the >> initial language, something we don't currently track in Sugar. >> Thoughts on this? >> >>> Tony >>> >>> >>> On 08/12/2015 01:56 PM, Sam P. wrote: >>> >>> Hey Tony, >>> >>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:51 PM Tony Anderson >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi, Sam >>>> >>>> My concern is not the execution of the panel, but how we explain it to >>>> users. Remember our target audience is teachers and students in primary >>>> school in the >>>> developing world with little or no prior computer experience. As >>>> developers, we often see things as simple because we have used many >>>> others >>>> like it. It may not >>>> be so simple to those who do not have that experience. >>> >>> >>> Yep. But we don't have a selector in the intro, so they'd be pretty >>> amazing >>> to find the language settings if it wasn't configured by their deployment >>> :) >>> >>>> >>>> However, we probably should think about the dialect/region selection. If >>>> I >>>> have selected Arabic, perhaps the dialect/region list should be in >>>> Arabic. >>> >>> >>> Ticket: https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4449 >>> >>>> >>>> We may also want to think about that list - do the entries represent >>>> countries where the language is spoken or represent dialects? I suspect >>>> the >>>> lists were >>>> copied from earlier releases. >>> >>> >>> They're just the system languages, so that is an issue for the >>> distribution. >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Tony >>>> >>>> >>>> On 08/12/2015 01:38 PM, Sam P. wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi Tony, >>>> >>>> The control panel is very simple. The left column is the language and >>>> the >>>> right column is the region/dialect. >>>> >>>> Maybe that should be a column header? >>>> >>>> Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons. The dropdown for >>>> the >>>> language selectors in a up or down arrow, while the add a new language >>>> button is a "+". The hitbox for the expand/contract the dropdown >>>> includes >>>> the button and the label, making it more discoverable. >>>> >>>> Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) to be more >>>> consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui considering it does a very >>>> complex job. >>>> >>>> I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image that you are >>>> running, >>>> can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're describing. >>>> >>>> Please consider opening separate tickets for the issues. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Sam >>>> >>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the button to the >>>>> left of the language (English) to >>>>> get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or region?). >>>>> You >>>>> click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the >>>>> + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the top right >>>>> button to restart as always. >>>>> >>>>> After restarting the added language (German) is the system language. >>>>> However, when going back to the >>>>> language selection in settings, German is the only language shown. So >>>>> you need to click to open the language >>>>> list, click on English. This opens up the options of Australien and >>>>> USA. >>>>> Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German >>>>> option has disappeared. >>>>> >>>>> I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. That list >>>>> is >>>>> in English. I selected Egypt and was able to >>>>> switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to the left >>>>> of >>>>> Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages >>>>> in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is evidently shown >>>>> in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected >>>>> Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. I >>>>> selected >>>>> USA and switched the system to Spanish. >>>>> >>>>> I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in Spanish >>>>> (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice >>>>> of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original English, >>>>> USA option. >>>>> >>>>> Tony >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it >>>>>> is to switch >>>>>> languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. >>>>>> >>>>>> In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long >>>>>> list of supported >>>>>> languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the order >>>>>> you prefer'. >>>>>> So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English USA + - >>>>>> >>>>>> In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that >>>>>> English USA. >>>>>> >>>>>> However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button to the >>>>>> left of the word English. This >>>>>> opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: >>>>>> Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... >>>>>> >>>>>> Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' button at >>>>>> least in my case led to confusion. >>>>>> >>>>>> Tony >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>>> . >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>> >> >> > -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org From tony_anderson at usa.net Wed Aug 12 11:48:43 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 17:48:43 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> <55CB466A.2050501@usa.net> <55CB5049.2080608@usa.net> Message-ID: <55CB6ADB.80708@usa.net> Hi, Walter I agree. I meant that the way the language panel is set up now looks like that this was the intent of the + and - buttons. I think the real problem with that screen is the first line that starts with 'add' coupled with the + button which suggests that you should click on + to add another language. The reset to default button would certainly make it easier to recover from an accidental switch. Tony On 08/12/2015 04:02 PM, Walter Bender wrote: > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:55 AM, Tony Anderson wrote: >> Hi, Walter >> >> When I saw the language panel, I thought it was trying to work like the Mate >> keyboard panel. You start with a default. You >> add options. Then you use the panel to select an option. Such an approach >> would make it easy to 'get out of' a wrong selection. > I don't think the two are analogous. While you can add language > options, the typical use is to select the default language, which will > override the UI after restart. Open to suggestions, but I think a > reset button that is always in the initial language may be a decent > solution. > > -walter > >> Tony >> >> >> >> On 08/12/2015 03:34 PM, Walter Bender wrote: >>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:13 AM, Tony Anderson >>> wrote: >>>> Hi, Sam >>>> >>>> In Rwanda, the students found the language panel (after all, they are >>>> supposed to try everything) and switched their system to Arabic, probably >>>> because it looked interesting and was at the top of the list. However, >>>> finding a teacher able to switch back to English was a bit trickier. >>>> >>>> Actually, I think the developers haven't really thought through the >>>> deployment process. The computers are typically batch flashed before >>>> being >>>> assigned to students. >>>> So the setting of nickname, color and now gender and grade level can't be >>>> done at that time. So in our workshops, we need to explain to the >>>> teachers >>>> how to >>>> provide (or have the children provide) the correct information through >>>> settings. Despite being one laptop per child, in reality many deployments >>>> share one laptop >>>> among several students (e.g. class 4 in this hour and class 5 in the next >>>> hour). As a consequence, the statistics gathered by these settings are >>>> really not accurate. >>> Not sure what you mean bu accurate, but clearly under these >>> circumstances the stats package that Martin developed would apply to >>> groups of students rather than individual students. It could still >>> inform us regarding what apps are used in the aggregate. >>> >>>> Several schools set the nick to a local id number which is also written >>>> on >>>> the XO. This ID is how students identify which one is theirs in the >>>> charging >>>> rack. >>>> >>>> So designing a specific interaction on the basis that it will be done by >>>> an >>>> experienced computer user and that others will be done by students and >>>> teachers is difficult. >>> It is inevitable that some laptops are going to have the language set >>> to a language which makes settings difficult to manage. Maybe we >>> should have some way to resetting to the language in which the laptop >>> was originally flashed -- a single button click on the language >>> control panel section? This will require our keeping track of the >>> initial language, something we don't currently track in Sugar. >>> Thoughts on this? >>> >>>> Tony >>>> >>>> >>>> On 08/12/2015 01:56 PM, Sam P. wrote: >>>> >>>> Hey Tony, >>>> >>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:51 PM Tony Anderson >>>> wrote: >>>>> Hi, Sam >>>>> >>>>> My concern is not the execution of the panel, but how we explain it to >>>>> users. Remember our target audience is teachers and students in primary >>>>> school in the >>>>> developing world with little or no prior computer experience. As >>>>> developers, we often see things as simple because we have used many >>>>> others >>>>> like it. It may not >>>>> be so simple to those who do not have that experience. >>>> >>>> Yep. But we don't have a selector in the intro, so they'd be pretty >>>> amazing >>>> to find the language settings if it wasn't configured by their deployment >>>> :) >>>> >>>>> However, we probably should think about the dialect/region selection. If >>>>> I >>>>> have selected Arabic, perhaps the dialect/region list should be in >>>>> Arabic. >>>> >>>> Ticket: https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4449 >>>> >>>>> We may also want to think about that list - do the entries represent >>>>> countries where the language is spoken or represent dialects? I suspect >>>>> the >>>>> lists were >>>>> copied from earlier releases. >>>> >>>> They're just the system languages, so that is an issue for the >>>> distribution. >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Tony >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 08/12/2015 01:38 PM, Sam P. wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi Tony, >>>>> >>>>> The control panel is very simple. The left column is the language and >>>>> the >>>>> right column is the region/dialect. >>>>> >>>>> Maybe that should be a column header? >>>>> >>>>> Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons. The dropdown for >>>>> the >>>>> language selectors in a up or down arrow, while the add a new language >>>>> button is a "+". The hitbox for the expand/contract the dropdown >>>>> includes >>>>> the button and the label, making it more discoverable. >>>>> >>>>> Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) to be more >>>>> consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui considering it does a very >>>>> complex job. >>>>> >>>>> I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image that you are >>>>> running, >>>>> can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're describing. >>>>> >>>>> Please consider opening separate tickets for the issues. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Sam >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the button to the >>>>>> left of the language (English) to >>>>>> get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or region?). >>>>>> You >>>>>> click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the >>>>>> + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the top right >>>>>> button to restart as always. >>>>>> >>>>>> After restarting the added language (German) is the system language. >>>>>> However, when going back to the >>>>>> language selection in settings, German is the only language shown. So >>>>>> you need to click to open the language >>>>>> list, click on English. This opens up the options of Australien and >>>>>> USA. >>>>>> Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German >>>>>> option has disappeared. >>>>>> >>>>>> I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. That list >>>>>> is >>>>>> in English. I selected Egypt and was able to >>>>>> switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to the left >>>>>> of >>>>>> Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages >>>>>> in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is evidently shown >>>>>> in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected >>>>>> Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. I >>>>>> selected >>>>>> USA and switched the system to Spanish. >>>>>> >>>>>> I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in Spanish >>>>>> (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice >>>>>> of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original English, >>>>>> USA option. >>>>>> >>>>>> Tony >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: >>>>>>> I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it >>>>>>> is to switch >>>>>>> languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long >>>>>>> list of supported >>>>>>> languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the order >>>>>>> you prefer'. >>>>>>> So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English USA + - >>>>>>> >>>>>>> In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that >>>>>>> English USA. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button to the >>>>>>> left of the word English. This >>>>>>> opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: >>>>>>> Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' button at >>>>>>> least in my case led to confusion. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Tony >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>>>> . >>>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>> >>> > > From tim at timmoody.com Wed Aug 12 12:40:30 2015 From: tim at timmoody.com (Tim Moody) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 12:40:30 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support (Tony Anderson) Message-ID: I did a language picker for xsce and the approach I took was to put each language in its native form, so Deutsch not German and ?????? not Hindi. So in Arabic English would still be English. The only quandary is sort order. I chose unicode, which means all the non-Roman scripts come at the end. From godiard at sugarlabs.org Wed Aug 12 15:11:51 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 16:11:51 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support (Tony Anderson) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: How you get the list of languages and the translated names? On Aug 12, 2015 1:40 PM, "Tim Moody" wrote: > I did a language picker for xsce and the approach I took was to put each > language in its native form, so Deutsch not German and ?????? not Hindi. > So in Arabic English would still be English. The only quandary is sort > order. I chose unicode, which means all the non-Roman scripts come at the > end. > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at sugarlabs.org Wed Aug 12 15:19:37 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 16:19:37 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: <55CB6ADB.80708@usa.net> References: <55CB261D.1010307@usa.net> <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> <55CB466A.2050501@usa.net> <55CB5049.2080608@usa.net> <55CB6ADB.80708@usa.net> Message-ID: I think Tony is describing a problem on the language selector on 0.106, already fixed on 0.108. If you add a new language, by default add English -USA, if the user don't change that default and restart, the second language is not added. Try the same on sugar-build and should work On Aug 12, 2015 12:49 PM, "Tony Anderson" wrote: > Hi, Walter > > I agree. I meant that the way the language panel is set up now looks like > that this was the intent of the + and - buttons. I think the real problem > with > that screen is the first line that starts with 'add' coupled with the + > button which suggests that you should click on + to add another language. > The > reset to default button would certainly make it easier to recover from an > accidental switch. > > Tony > > On 08/12/2015 04:02 PM, Walter Bender wrote: > >> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:55 AM, Tony Anderson >> wrote: >> >>> Hi, Walter >>> >>> When I saw the language panel, I thought it was trying to work like the >>> Mate >>> keyboard panel. You start with a default. You >>> add options. Then you use the panel to select an option. Such an approach >>> would make it easy to 'get out of' a wrong selection. >>> >> I don't think the two are analogous. While you can add language >> options, the typical use is to select the default language, which will >> override the UI after restart. Open to suggestions, but I think a >> reset button that is always in the initial language may be a decent >> solution. >> >> -walter >> >> Tony >>> >>> >>> >>> On 08/12/2015 03:34 PM, Walter Bender wrote: >>> >>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:13 AM, Tony Anderson >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi, Sam >>>>> >>>>> In Rwanda, the students found the language panel (after all, they are >>>>> supposed to try everything) and switched their system to Arabic, >>>>> probably >>>>> because it looked interesting and was at the top of the list. However, >>>>> finding a teacher able to switch back to English was a bit trickier. >>>>> >>>>> Actually, I think the developers haven't really thought through the >>>>> deployment process. The computers are typically batch flashed before >>>>> being >>>>> assigned to students. >>>>> So the setting of nickname, color and now gender and grade level can't >>>>> be >>>>> done at that time. So in our workshops, we need to explain to the >>>>> teachers >>>>> how to >>>>> provide (or have the children provide) the correct information through >>>>> settings. Despite being one laptop per child, in reality many >>>>> deployments >>>>> share one laptop >>>>> among several students (e.g. class 4 in this hour and class 5 in the >>>>> next >>>>> hour). As a consequence, the statistics gathered by these settings are >>>>> really not accurate. >>>>> >>>> Not sure what you mean bu accurate, but clearly under these >>>> circumstances the stats package that Martin developed would apply to >>>> groups of students rather than individual students. It could still >>>> inform us regarding what apps are used in the aggregate. >>>> >>>> Several schools set the nick to a local id number which is also written >>>>> on >>>>> the XO. This ID is how students identify which one is theirs in the >>>>> charging >>>>> rack. >>>>> >>>>> So designing a specific interaction on the basis that it will be done >>>>> by >>>>> an >>>>> experienced computer user and that others will be done by students and >>>>> teachers is difficult. >>>>> >>>> It is inevitable that some laptops are going to have the language set >>>> to a language which makes settings difficult to manage. Maybe we >>>> should have some way to resetting to the language in which the laptop >>>> was originally flashed -- a single button click on the language >>>> control panel section? This will require our keeping track of the >>>> initial language, something we don't currently track in Sugar. >>>> Thoughts on this? >>>> >>>> Tony >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 08/12/2015 01:56 PM, Sam P. wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hey Tony, >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:51 PM Tony Anderson >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi, Sam >>>>>> >>>>>> My concern is not the execution of the panel, but how we explain it to >>>>>> users. Remember our target audience is teachers and students in >>>>>> primary >>>>>> school in the >>>>>> developing world with little or no prior computer experience. As >>>>>> developers, we often see things as simple because we have used many >>>>>> others >>>>>> like it. It may not >>>>>> be so simple to those who do not have that experience. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Yep. But we don't have a selector in the intro, so they'd be pretty >>>>> amazing >>>>> to find the language settings if it wasn't configured by their >>>>> deployment >>>>> :) >>>>> >>>>> However, we probably should think about the dialect/region selection. >>>>>> If >>>>>> I >>>>>> have selected Arabic, perhaps the dialect/region list should be in >>>>>> Arabic. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Ticket: https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4449 >>>>> >>>>> We may also want to think about that list - do the entries represent >>>>>> countries where the language is spoken or represent dialects? I >>>>>> suspect >>>>>> the >>>>>> lists were >>>>>> copied from earlier releases. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> They're just the system languages, so that is an issue for the >>>>> distribution. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Tony >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 08/12/2015 01:38 PM, Sam P. wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Tony, >>>>>> >>>>>> The control panel is very simple. The left column is the language and >>>>>> the >>>>>> right column is the region/dialect. >>>>>> >>>>>> Maybe that should be a column header? >>>>>> >>>>>> Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons. The dropdown for >>>>>> the >>>>>> language selectors in a up or down arrow, while the add a new language >>>>>> button is a "+". The hitbox for the expand/contract the dropdown >>>>>> includes >>>>>> the button and the label, making it more discoverable. >>>>>> >>>>>> Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) to be more >>>>>> consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui considering it does a >>>>>> very >>>>>> complex job. >>>>>> >>>>>> I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image that you are >>>>>> running, >>>>>> can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're describing. >>>>>> >>>>>> Please consider opening separate tickets for the issues. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> Sam >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> To continue the story. The way it works, you click on the button to >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> left of the language (English) to >>>>>>> get a list. You click on the language to get a dialect (or region?). >>>>>>> You >>>>>>> click on the dialect to select it. You then click on the >>>>>>> + button to get it 'really' selected. You then click on the top right >>>>>>> button to restart as always. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> After restarting the added language (German) is the system language. >>>>>>> However, when going back to the >>>>>>> language selection in settings, German is the only language shown. So >>>>>>> you need to click to open the language >>>>>>> list, click on English. This opens up the options of Australien and >>>>>>> USA. >>>>>>> Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German >>>>>>> option has disappeared. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects available. That list >>>>>>> is >>>>>>> in English. I selected Egypt and was able to >>>>>>> switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the button to the left >>>>>>> of >>>>>>> Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages >>>>>>> in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English is evidently >>>>>>> shown >>>>>>> in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected >>>>>>> Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic except USA. I >>>>>>> selected >>>>>>> USA and switched the system to Spanish. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I then went back to settings and got a list of languages in Spanish >>>>>>> (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice >>>>>>> of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the original English, >>>>>>> USA option. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Tony >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday trying to show how easy it >>>>>>>> is to switch >>>>>>>> languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> In previous versions, you go to settings and language and get a long >>>>>>>> list of supported >>>>>>>> languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add languages in the >>>>>>>> order >>>>>>>> you prefer'. >>>>>>>> So I clicked on + to add German. It added another row: English USA >>>>>>>> + - >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any other language that >>>>>>>> English USA. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> However, today I found that the trick is to click on the button to >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> left of the word English. This >>>>>>>> opens the expected list. Click on German adds a line with dialects: >>>>>>>> Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' together with a '+' button >>>>>>>> at >>>>>>>> least in my case led to confusion. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Tony >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fgrose at sugarlabs.org Wed Aug 12 16:58:09 2015 From: fgrose at sugarlabs.org (Frederick Grose) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 16:58:09 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support (Tony Anderson) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 3:11 PM, Gonzalo Odiard wrote: > How you get the list of languages and the translated names? > On Aug 12, 2015 1:40 PM, "Tim Moody" wrote: > >> I did a language picker for xsce and the approach I took was to put each >> language in its native form, so Deutsch not German and ?????? not Hindi. >> So in Arabic English would still be English. The only quandary is sort >> order. I chose unicode, which means all the non-Roman scripts come at the >> end. >> > ?The Sugar Labs wiki sidebar source has a Google Translation section that was easy to get translated language names. http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Sidebar&action=edit? ?I attempted to sort the list roughly phonetically? according to common sounds of Latin alphabet letters. Wikipedia's language letter code sorting results in something similar due to the selection of the letter codes. There are errors due to my ignorance of pronunciation. Reliable pronunciation sources would allow the errors to be corrected. Center alignment avoids left-to-right vs right-to-left bias. No attempt to was made to avoid the horizontal vs vertical reading direction bias. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quozl at laptop.org Wed Aug 12 18:44:33 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2015 08:44:33 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support In-Reply-To: References: <55CB2D65.2020105@usa.net> <55CB331C.5090002@usa.net> <55CB466A.2050501@usa.net> <55CB5049.2080608@usa.net> <55CB6ADB.80708@usa.net> Message-ID: <20150812224433.GA4047@us.netrek.org> I agree. Tony, please make sure you test the changes that have already been done for 0.108. On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 04:19:37PM -0300, Gonzalo Odiard wrote: > I think Tony is describing a problem on the language selector on 0.106, already > fixed on 0.108. > If you add a new language, by default add English -USA, > if the user don't change that default and restart, the second language is not > added. > Try the same on sugar-build and should work > > On Aug 12, 2015 12:49 PM, "Tony Anderson" <[1]tony_anderson at usa.net> wrote: > > Hi, Walter > > I agree. I meant that the way the language panel is set up now looks like > that this was the intent of the + and - buttons.? I think the real problem > with > that screen is the first line that starts with 'add' coupled with the + > button which suggests that you should click on + to add another language. > The > reset to default button would certainly make it easier to recover from an > accidental switch. > > Tony > > On 08/12/2015 04:02 PM, Walter Bender wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:55 AM, Tony Anderson <[2] > tony_anderson at usa.net> wrote: > > Hi, Walter > > When I saw the language panel, I thought it was trying to work like > the Mate > keyboard panel. You start with a default. You > add options. Then you use the panel to select an option. Such an > approach > would make it easy to 'get out of' a wrong selection. > > I don't think the two are analogous. While you can add language > options, the typical use is to select the default language, which will > override the UI after restart. Open to suggestions, but I think a > reset button that is always in the initial language may be a decent > solution. > > -walter > > Tony > > On 08/12/2015 03:34 PM, Walter Bender wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:13 AM, Tony Anderson <[3] > tony_anderson at usa.net> > wrote: > > Hi, Sam > > In Rwanda, the students found the language panel (after > all, they are > supposed to try everything) and switched their system to > Arabic, probably > because it looked interesting and was at the top of the > list. However, > finding a teacher able to switch back to English was a bit > trickier. > > Actually, I think the developers haven't really thought > through the > deployment process. The computers are typically batch > flashed before > being > assigned to students. > So the setting of nickname, color and now gender and grade > level can't be > done at that time. So in our workshops, we need to explain > to the > teachers > how to > provide (or have the children provide) the correct > information through > settings. Despite being one laptop per child, in reality > many deployments > share one laptop > among several students (e.g. class 4 in this hour and class > 5 in the next > hour). As a consequence, the statistics gathered by these > settings are > really not accurate. > > Not sure what you mean bu accurate, but clearly under these > circumstances the stats package that Martin developed would > apply to > groups of students rather than individual students. It could > still > inform us regarding what apps are used in the aggregate. > > Several schools set the nick to a local id number which is > also written > on > the XO. This ID is how students identify which one is > theirs in the > charging > rack. > > So designing a specific interaction on the basis that it > will be done by > an > experienced computer user and that others will be done by > students and > teachers is difficult. > > It is inevitable that some laptops are going to have the > language set > to a language which makes settings difficult to manage. Maybe > we > should have some way to resetting to the language in which the > laptop > was originally flashed -- a single button click on the language > control panel section? This will require our keeping track of > the > initial language, something we don't currently track in Sugar. > Thoughts on this? > > Tony > > On 08/12/2015 01:56 PM, Sam P. wrote: > > Hey Tony, > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:51 PM Tony Anderson <[4] > tony_anderson at usa.net> > wrote: > > Hi, Sam > > My concern is not the execution of the panel, but how > we explain it to > users. Remember our target audience is teachers and > students in primary > school in the > developing world with little or no prior computer > experience. As > developers, we often see things as simple because we > have used many > others > like it. It may not > be so simple to those who do not have that experience. > > Yep.? But we don't have a selector in the intro, so they'd > be pretty > amazing > to find the language settings if it wasn't configured by > their deployment > :) > > However, we probably should think about the dialect/ > region selection. If > I > have selected Arabic, perhaps the dialect/region list > should be in > Arabic. > > Ticket:? [5]https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4449 > > We may also want to think about that list - do the > entries represent > countries where the language is spoken or represent > dialects? I suspect > the > lists were > copied from earlier releases. > > They're just the system languages, so that is an issue for > the > distribution. > > Tony > > On 08/12/2015 01:38 PM, Sam P. wrote: > > Hi Tony, > > The control panel is very simple.? The left column is > the language and > the > right column is the region/dialect. > > Maybe that should be a column header? > > Also, there is no conflicting "+" and "add" buttons.? > The dropdown for > the > language selectors in a up or down arrow, while the add > a new language > button is a "+".? The hitbox for the expand/contract > the dropdown > includes > the button and the label, making it more discoverable. > > Maybe it should use palettes (or modals with search!) > to be more > consistent, but it is actually a very nice ui > considering it does a very > complex job. > > I opened the control panel on the same OLPC OS image > that you are > running, > can can not reproduce many (any?) of the issues you're > describing. > > Please consider opening separate tickets for the > issues. > > Thanks, > Sam > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:26 PM Tony Anderson <[6] > tony_anderson at usa.net> > wrote: > > Hi, > > To continue the story. The way it works, you click > on the button to the > left of the language (English) to > get a list. You click on the language to get a > dialect (or region?). > You > click on the dialect to select it. You then click > on the > + button to get it 'really' selected. You then > click on the top right > button to restart as always. > > After restarting the added language (German) is the > system language. > However, when going back to the > language selection in settings, German is the only > language shown. So > you need to click to open the language > list, click on English. This opens up the options > of Australien and > USA. > Incidentally, that is now the only line, the German > option has disappeared. > > I tried Arabic. There are 12 regions or dialects > available. That list > is > in English. I selected Egypt and was able to > switch to Arabic. To switch back, I clicked on the > button to the left > of > Arabic (only line). It lists alternate languages > in a mixture of Arabic and Latin alphabets. English > is evidently shown > in Arabic but Spanish is Spanish. I selected > Spanish getting 21 regional choices all in Arabic > except USA. I > selected > USA and switched the system to Spanish. > > I then went back to settings and got a list of > languages in Spanish > (Ingl?s). I selected that option and got a choice > of Australia and USA. I was able to get back to the > original English, > USA option. > > Tony > > On 08/12/2015 12:55 PM, Tony Anderson wrote: > > I was surprised and embarrassed yesterday > trying to show how easy it > is to switch > languages. I was using a 13.2.5 image. > > In previous versions, you go to settings and > language and get a long > list of supported > languages. In 13.2.5, you get a statement: 'Add > languages in the order > you prefer'. > So I clicked on + to add German. It added > another row: English USA + - > > In the press of the moment, I couldn't find any > other language that > English USA. > > However, today I found that the trick is to > click on the button to the > left of the word English. This > opens the expected list. Click on German adds a > line with dialects: > Austria, Belgium, Germany, ... > > Unfortunately, the use of the word 'add' > together with a '+' button at > least in my case led to confusion. > > Tony > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > [7]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [8]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/ > sugar-devel > . > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > [9]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [10]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > [11]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [12]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > [13]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [14]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > [15]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [16]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > References: > > [1] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net > [2] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net > [3] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net > [4] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net > [5] https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4449 > [6] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net > [7] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [8] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > [9] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [10] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > [11] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [12] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > [13] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [14] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > [15] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [16] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From quozl at laptop.org Wed Aug 12 18:48:52 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2015 08:48:52 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speak Activity In-Reply-To: <55CB515E.2030403@usa.net> References: <55CB489D.8030300@usa.net> <55CB515E.2030403@usa.net> Message-ID: <20150812224852.GB4047@us.netrek.org> Yes, please update it Tony. https://github.com/godiard/help-activity/blob/master/source/speak.rst http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Help/Contribute On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 03:59:58PM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote: > Hi, Walter > > Thanks. Sadly, that shows we don't have Arabic support in Speak. Perhaps the > Help description on Speak should be updated. > > Tony > > On 08/12/2015 03:40 PM, Walter Bender wrote: > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:22 AM, Tony Anderson [1] wrote: > > Hi, Gonzalo > > I am getting involved in a new deployment which needs Arabic support. So I > was trying to describe what is available and what may need some work. I > wanted > to point to the Speak activity but first wanted to check if Arabic is one of > the languages. I was a bit surprised to find that language selection is not > in > version 51 (13.2.5). The help activity still shows it in the screen-shot. > > It is still there, just under the voice attributes toolbar instead of > on the main toolbar. See attached. > > regards. > > -walter > > Tony > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > [2]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [3]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > [4]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [5]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > References: > > [1] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net > [2] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [3] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > [4] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [5] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From tim at timmoody.com Wed Aug 12 19:04:07 2015 From: tim at timmoody.com (Tim Moody) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 19:04:07 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Language Support (Tony Anderson) (Frederick Grose) Message-ID: I agree that phonetic is a better, but I didn't have the time to create the map. If you have a map or ordered list, I'd love to have it. I took that approach for the limited list of languages on the home page menu (though I just noticed that Hindi and Kreyol are out of order). > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 16:58:09 -0400 > From: Frederick Grose > To: "sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org" > > Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] Language Support (Tony Anderson) > Message-ID: > mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 3:11 PM, Gonzalo Odiard > wrote: > > > How you get the list of languages and the translated names? > > On Aug 12, 2015 1:40 PM, "Tim Moody" wrote: > > > >> I did a language picker for xsce and the approach I took was to put > >> each language in its native form, so Deutsch not German and ?????? not > Hindi. > >> So in Arabic English would still be English. The only quandary is > >> sort order. I chose unicode, which means all the non-Roman scripts > >> come at the end. > >> > > > ?The Sugar Labs wiki sidebar source has a Google Translation section that was > easy to get translated language names. > http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Sidebar&action=edit? > > > ?I attempted to sort the list roughly phonetically? according to common > sounds of Latin alphabet letters. Wikipedia's language letter code sorting > results in something similar due to the selection of the letter codes. > There are errors due to my ignorance of pronunciation. Reliable > pronunciation sources would allow the errors to be corrected. > > Center alignment avoids left-to-right vs right-to-left bias. No attempt to was > made to avoid the horizontal vs vertical reading direction bias. ********************** From fgrose at gmail.com Wed Aug 12 19:44:17 2015 From: fgrose at gmail.com (Frederick Grose) Date: Wed, 12 Aug 2015 19:44:17 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-runner fails to launch in Fedora 23 with GNOME_KEYRING_PID error Message-ID: See https://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4886 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tony_anderson at usa.net Thu Aug 13 02:53:16 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2015 08:53:16 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speak Activity In-Reply-To: <20150812224852.GB4047@us.netrek.org> References: <55CB489D.8030300@usa.net> <55CB515E.2030403@usa.net> <20150812224852.GB4047@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: <55CC3EDC.1060809@usa.net> Wouldn't it be better to make Speak work as described in the documentation? Tony On 08/13/2015 12:48 AM, James Cameron wrote: > Yes, please update it Tony. > > https://github.com/godiard/help-activity/blob/master/source/speak.rst > http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Help/Contribute > > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 03:59:58PM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote: >> Hi, Walter >> >> Thanks. Sadly, that shows we don't have Arabic support in Speak. Perhaps the >> Help description on Speak should be updated. >> >> Tony >> >> On 08/12/2015 03:40 PM, Walter Bender wrote: >> >> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:22 AM, Tony Anderson [1] wrote: >> >> Hi, Gonzalo >> >> I am getting involved in a new deployment which needs Arabic support. So I >> was trying to describe what is available and what may need some work. I >> wanted >> to point to the Speak activity but first wanted to check if Arabic is one of >> the languages. I was a bit surprised to find that language selection is not >> in >> version 51 (13.2.5). The help activity still shows it in the screen-shot. >> >> It is still there, just under the voice attributes toolbar instead of >> on the main toolbar. See attached. >> >> regards. >> >> -walter >> >> Tony >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> [2]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> [3]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> [4]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> [5]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> >> References: >> >> [1] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net >> [2] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> [3] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> [4] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> [5] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > From quozl at laptop.org Thu Aug 13 03:47:29 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2015 17:47:29 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speak Activity In-Reply-To: <55CC3EDC.1060809@usa.net> References: <55CB489D.8030300@usa.net> <55CB515E.2030403@usa.net> <20150812224852.GB4047@us.netrek.org> <55CC3EDC.1060809@usa.net> Message-ID: <20150813074729.GJ4047@us.netrek.org> No, not really. The documentation still needs changing for the position of the language selection, using the latest version of Speak, regardless of your problem with Arabic missing. That's what I thought you were suggesting with: > Perhaps the Help description on Speak should be updated. Underneath Sugar, your problem of Arabic support is that "espeak --voices" command doesn't list Arabic, because it is not supported in eSpeak: http://espeak.sourceforge.net/languages.html A quick search for espeak arabic yields Al-Mintiq and ar-espeak projects. Fedora doesn't have these packaged. So it looks like a challenge to add Arabic. Let us know how you go with that. On Thu, Aug 13, 2015 at 08:53:16AM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote: > Wouldn't it be better to make Speak work as described in the documentation? > > Tony > On 08/13/2015 12:48 AM, James Cameron wrote: > >Yes, please update it Tony. > > > >https://github.com/godiard/help-activity/blob/master/source/speak.rst > >http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Help/Contribute > > > >On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 03:59:58PM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote: > >>Hi, Walter > >> > >>Thanks. Sadly, that shows we don't have Arabic support in Speak. Perhaps the > >>Help description on Speak should be updated. > >> > >>Tony > >> > >>On 08/12/2015 03:40 PM, Walter Bender wrote: > >> > >> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:22 AM, Tony Anderson [1] wrote: > >> > >> Hi, Gonzalo > >> > >> I am getting involved in a new deployment which needs Arabic support. So I > >> was trying to describe what is available and what may need some work. I > >> wanted > >> to point to the Speak activity but first wanted to check if Arabic is one of > >> the languages. I was a bit surprised to find that language selection is not > >> in > >> version 51 (13.2.5). The help activity still shows it in the screen-shot. > >> > >> It is still there, just under the voice attributes toolbar instead of > >> on the main toolbar. See attached. > >> > >> regards. > >> > >> -walter > >> > >> Tony > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Sugar-devel mailing list > >> [2]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > >> [3]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Sugar-devel mailing list > >> [4]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > >> [5]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > >> > >>References: > >> > >>[1] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net > >>[2] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > >>[3] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > >>[4] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > >>[5] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > >>_______________________________________________ > >>Sugar-devel mailing list > >>Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > >>http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From tony_anderson at usa.net Thu Aug 13 06:31:06 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2015 12:31:06 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speak Activity In-Reply-To: <20150813074729.GJ4047@us.netrek.org> References: <55CB489D.8030300@usa.net> <55CB515E.2030403@usa.net> <20150812224852.GB4047@us.netrek.org> <55CC3EDC.1060809@usa.net> <20150813074729.GJ4047@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: <55CC71EA.2040402@usa.net> Hi, James The current help shows the 'traditional' Speak. I thought you wanted me to document the change with new screenshots, etc. Personally, I see no problem with the traditional technique. It makes the language selection more accessible and its what users know. The 'Arabic' issue is quite other. A language is implemented in Speak by supplying a file of phonemes corresponding to the language as it is spoken in a particular area (e.g. Arabic may be pronounced differently in Egypt and Morrocco. The phonemes are coded using linguistics conventions. At one point, we tried to get a Nepali langauge by modifying the phonemes of Hindu - this turned out to be beyond the capacity of some very intelligent interns. We could perhaps find if the contributor of Speak has added languages to his version which we have not incorporated in Speak - but that would be a new version and some work. Volunteers are certainly welcome. Tony On 08/13/2015 09:47 AM, James Cameron wrote: > No, not really. > > The documentation still needs changing for the position of the > language selection, using the latest version of Speak, regardless of > your problem with Arabic missing. That's what I thought you were > suggesting with: > >> Perhaps the Help description on Speak should be updated. > Underneath Sugar, your problem of Arabic support is that "espeak > --voices" command doesn't list Arabic, because it is not supported in > eSpeak: > > http://espeak.sourceforge.net/languages.html > > A quick search for espeak arabic yields Al-Mintiq and ar-espeak > projects. Fedora doesn't have these packaged. > > So it looks like a challenge to add Arabic. Let us know how you go > with that. > > On Thu, Aug 13, 2015 at 08:53:16AM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote: >> Wouldn't it be better to make Speak work as described in the documentation? >> >> Tony >> On 08/13/2015 12:48 AM, James Cameron wrote: >>> Yes, please update it Tony. >>> >>> https://github.com/godiard/help-activity/blob/master/source/speak.rst >>> http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Help/Contribute >>> >>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 03:59:58PM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote: >>>> Hi, Walter >>>> >>>> Thanks. Sadly, that shows we don't have Arabic support in Speak. Perhaps the >>>> Help description on Speak should be updated. >>>> >>>> Tony >>>> >>>> On 08/12/2015 03:40 PM, Walter Bender wrote: >>>> >>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:22 AM, Tony Anderson [1] wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi, Gonzalo >>>> >>>> I am getting involved in a new deployment which needs Arabic support. So I >>>> was trying to describe what is available and what may need some work. I >>>> wanted >>>> to point to the Speak activity but first wanted to check if Arabic is one of >>>> the languages. I was a bit surprised to find that language selection is not >>>> in >>>> version 51 (13.2.5). The help activity still shows it in the screen-shot. >>>> >>>> It is still there, just under the voice attributes toolbar instead of >>>> on the main toolbar. See attached. >>>> >>>> regards. >>>> >>>> -walter >>>> >>>> Tony >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>> [2]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>> [3]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>> [4]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>> [5]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>> >>>> References: >>>> >>>> [1] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net >>>> [2] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>> [3] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>> [4] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>> [5] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel From walter.bender at gmail.com Thu Aug 13 09:26:35 2015 From: walter.bender at gmail.com (Walter Bender) Date: Thu, 13 Aug 2015 09:26:35 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speak Activity In-Reply-To: <55CC71EA.2040402@usa.net> References: <55CB489D.8030300@usa.net> <55CB515E.2030403@usa.net> <20150812224852.GB4047@us.netrek.org> <55CC3EDC.1060809@usa.net> <20150813074729.GJ4047@us.netrek.org> <55CC71EA.2040402@usa.net> Message-ID: On Thu, Aug 13, 2015 at 6:31 AM, Tony Anderson wrote: > Hi, James > > The current help shows the 'traditional' Speak. I thought you wanted me to > document the change with new screenshots, etc. Personally, > I see no problem with the traditional technique. It makes the language > selection more accessible and its what users know. It is what some users know. In any case, the change was not just for change sake: (1) in the old version, the main toolbar did not fit when the screen was rotated into portrait mode, which led to the decision to (2) move the language selection to the same submenu as the other voice-related controls. IMHO, which as maintainer carries some weight, the button is not used often enough to merit a spot on the main toolbar. But if I get enough push back from users -- yours is the first since I made the change more than 1 year ago -- I'd consider moving it back when the laptop is in portrait mode. > > The 'Arabic' issue is quite other. A language is implemented in Speak by > supplying a file of phonemes corresponding to the language as it is spoken > in > a particular area (e.g. Arabic may be pronounced differently in Egypt and > Morrocco. The phonemes are coded using linguistics conventions. At one > point, we tried to get a Nepali langauge by modifying the phonemes of Hindu > - this turned out to be beyond the capacity of some very intelligent > interns. > We could perhaps find if the contributor of Speak has added languages to his > version which we have not incorporated in Speak - but that would be a new > version and some work. Volunteers are certainly welcome. If you can find someone willing/able to do the work, I am happy to lend whatever support I can. -walter > > Tony > > On 08/13/2015 09:47 AM, James Cameron wrote: >> >> No, not really. >> >> The documentation still needs changing for the position of the >> language selection, using the latest version of Speak, regardless of >> your problem with Arabic missing. That's what I thought you were >> suggesting with: >> >>> Perhaps the Help description on Speak should be updated. >> >> Underneath Sugar, your problem of Arabic support is that "espeak >> --voices" command doesn't list Arabic, because it is not supported in >> eSpeak: >> >> http://espeak.sourceforge.net/languages.html >> >> A quick search for espeak arabic yields Al-Mintiq and ar-espeak >> projects. Fedora doesn't have these packaged. >> >> So it looks like a challenge to add Arabic. Let us know how you go >> with that. >> >> On Thu, Aug 13, 2015 at 08:53:16AM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote: >>> >>> Wouldn't it be better to make Speak work as described in the >>> documentation? >>> >>> Tony >>> On 08/13/2015 12:48 AM, James Cameron wrote: >>>> >>>> Yes, please update it Tony. >>>> >>>> https://github.com/godiard/help-activity/blob/master/source/speak.rst >>>> http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Help/Contribute >>>> >>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 03:59:58PM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi, Walter >>>>> >>>>> Thanks. Sadly, that shows we don't have Arabic support in Speak. >>>>> Perhaps the >>>>> Help description on Speak should be updated. >>>>> >>>>> Tony >>>>> >>>>> On 08/12/2015 03:40 PM, Walter Bender wrote: >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:22 AM, Tony Anderson >>>>> [1] wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi, Gonzalo >>>>> >>>>> I am getting involved in a new deployment which needs Arabic >>>>> support. So I >>>>> was trying to describe what is available and what may need >>>>> some work. I >>>>> wanted >>>>> to point to the Speak activity but first wanted to check if >>>>> Arabic is one of >>>>> the languages. I was a bit surprised to find that language >>>>> selection is not >>>>> in >>>>> version 51 (13.2.5). The help activity still shows it in the >>>>> screen-shot. >>>>> >>>>> It is still there, just under the voice attributes toolbar instead >>>>> of >>>>> on the main toolbar. See attached. >>>>> >>>>> regards. >>>>> >>>>> -walter >>>>> >>>>> Tony >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>> [2]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> [3]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>> [4]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> [5]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> >>>>> References: >>>>> >>>>> [1] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net >>>>> [2] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> [3] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> [4] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> [5] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org From yajosev at gmail.com Fri Aug 14 20:55:06 2015 From: yajosev at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Yader_Vel=C3=A1squez?=) Date: Fri, 14 Aug 2015 18:55:06 -0600 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speech synthesizer in sugar web Message-ID: Hi everyone, I'm not sure if this is the right place for this kind of questions, please let me know where I can ask for support about activity development. I'm working on an activity based on sugar web, I have to read some text from the screen and synthesize them. A quick glance in the web took me to the Web Speech API[1], but unfortunately it doesn't work within sugar osbuild. There are some third party libraries in the web, but I'm not sure what would be the best solution. The only requirements are to be supported by sugar web and to have spanish support. What do you suggest? Thank you. 1. https://developers.google.com/web/updates/2014/01/Web-apps-that-talk---Introduction-to-the-Speech-Synthesis-API?hl=en -- Yader. http://yaderv.wordpress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quozl at laptop.org Fri Aug 14 21:07:39 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Sat, 15 Aug 2015 11:07:39 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speech synthesizer in sugar web In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20150815010739.GA29172@us.netrek.org> It is a feature of the browser. What browser are you using? In what way does it not work? Does the feature detection test pass? if ('speechSynthesis' in window) { // Synthesis support. Make your web apps talk! } If you use the browser to visit html5test.com does the "Speech Synthesis" item have a "Yes ?"? On Fri, Aug 14, 2015 at 06:55:06PM -0600, Yader Vel?squez wrote: > Hi everyone, I'm not sure if this is the right place for this kind of > questions, please let me know where I can ask for support about activity > development. > > I'm working on an activity based on sugar web, I have to read some text from > the screen and synthesize them. A quick glance in the web took me to the Web > Speech API[1], but unfortunately it doesn't work within sugar osbuild.? > > There are some third party libraries in the web, but I'm not sure what would be > the best solution. The only requirements are to be supported by sugar web and > to have spanish support. What do you suggest? > > Thank you.? > > 1.?[1]https://developers.google.com/web/updates/2014/01/ > Web-apps-that-talk---Introduction-to-the-Speech-Synthesis-API?hl=en > > -- > Yader. > [2]http://yaderv.wordpress.com > > References: > > [1] https://developers.google.com/web/updates/2014/01/Web-apps-that-talk---Introduction-to-the-Speech-Synthesis-API?hl=en > [2] http://yaderv.wordpress.com/ > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From yajosev at gmail.com Fri Aug 14 21:44:46 2015 From: yajosev at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Yader_Vel=C3=A1squez?=) Date: Fri, 14 Aug 2015 19:44:46 -0600 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speech synthesizer in sugar web In-Reply-To: <20150815010739.GA29172@us.netrek.org> References: <20150815010739.GA29172@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: Hi James, Yes, I know it's a browser feature, I'm following the official doc to create web activities[1] but neither the browser activity neither the activity that I'm developing have that feature :( I did "window.navigator" in my activity console and this is what I got: appCodeName: "Mozilla" appName: "Netscape" appVersion: "5.0 (Macintosh, Intel Mac OS X ) AppleWebKit/538.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Safari/538.1" I need synthesize spanish text in the current browser engine that sugar uses to run web activities. Regards. It is a feature of the browser. What browser are you using? > > In what way does it not work? > > Does the feature detection test pass? > > if ('speechSynthesis' in window) { > // Synthesis support. Make your web apps talk! > } > > If you use the browser to visit html5test.com does the "Speech > Synthesis" item have a "Yes ?"? > [1] https://developer.sugarlabs.org/activity.md.html -- Yader. http://yaderv.wordpress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quozl at laptop.org Fri Aug 14 22:30:39 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Sat, 15 Aug 2015 12:30:39 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speech synthesizer in sugar web In-Reply-To: References: <20150815010739.GA29172@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: <20150815023039.GB29172@us.netrek.org> Well, I don't know anything about "sugar build", I don't use it or need it. But still it would be useful to identify your browser properly, try the feature detection test, and even use the browser to visit html5test.com. Your "window.navigator" response tells me nothing useful; I don't know how to reproduce it. The instructions [1] for setting up a development environment say you must run Linux, but you haven't said which Linux you have run. The browser is likely to come from there. 1. https://developer.sugarlabs.org/dev-environment.md.html -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From activities at sugarlabs.org Mon Aug 17 08:30:31 2015 From: activities at sugarlabs.org (Sugar Labs Activities) Date: Mon, 17 Aug 2015 08:30:31 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Sonic Jump-3 Message-ID: <616175785e91d6c9a78fb984a5554fd1@activities.sugarlabs.org> Activity Homepage: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/addon/4773 Sugar Platform: 0.82 - 0.104 Download Now: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29140/sonic_jump-3.xo Release notes: icon fixed. Sugar Labs Activities http://activities.sugarlabs.org From sam at sam.today Thu Aug 20 07:24:15 2015 From: sam at sam.today (Sam P.) Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2015 11:24:15 +0000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speech synthesizer in sugar web In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello Yander, Sugar uses webkit to run web activities. On sugar-build it is via WebKit2 (same as GNOME Web/Ephipany, Apple Safari) and WebKit(1) on XO. Neither of these platforms support the speech api, infact neither of them support many of the flashy new stuff :) Sugar however has tts built in powered by espeak. Users can highlight speech and use a button in the frame to play it back. Maybe you should look into exposing the tts functions provided by sugar3 to web activities? Then you could make an abstraction between the 2 backends. Of course, you could look into using [FireFox, CEF, Servo] to run sugar web activities, but that is another thing all together! Thanks, Sam On Sat, Aug 15, 2015 at 10:55 AM Yader Vel?squez wrote: > Hi everyone, I'm not sure if this is the right place for this kind of > questions, please let me know where I can ask for support about activity > development. > > I'm working on an activity based on sugar web, I have to read some text > from the screen and synthesize them. A quick glance in the web took me to > the Web Speech API[1], but unfortunately it doesn't work within sugar > osbuild. > > There are some third party libraries in the web, but I'm not sure what > would be the best solution. The only requirements are to be supported by > sugar web and to have spanish support. What do you suggest? > > Thank you. > > > 1. > https://developers.google.com/web/updates/2014/01/Web-apps-that-talk---Introduction-to-the-Speech-Synthesis-API?hl=en > > -- > Yader. > http://yaderv.wordpress.com > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at sugarlabs.org Thu Aug 20 09:59:51 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2015 10:59:51 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speak Activity In-Reply-To: <55CC71EA.2040402@usa.net> References: <55CB489D.8030300@usa.net> <55CB515E.2030403@usa.net> <20150812224852.GB4047@us.netrek.org> <55CC3EDC.1060809@usa.net> <20150813074729.GJ4047@us.netrek.org> <55CC71EA.2040402@usa.net> Message-ID: On Thu, Aug 13, 2015 at 7:31 AM, Tony Anderson wrote: > Hi, James > > The current help shows the 'traditional' Speak. I thought you wanted me to > document the change with new screenshots, etc. Personally, > I see no problem with the traditional technique. It makes the language > selection more accessible and its what users know. > > I think is better update the documentation. You can send me your changes for https://help.sugarlabs.org/speak.html in text format, and a new screenshot (max width 800px) Speak use the language configured in Sugar if is available, then, there are not too much need of use the languages button at least the user want change it. Walter already explained other reasons for the change. Speak activity will use any language available on espeak (see 'espeak --voices' as pointed by James) > The 'Arabic' issue is quite other. A language is implemented in Speak by > supplying a file of phonemes corresponding to the language as it is spoken > in > a particular area (e.g. Arabic may be pronounced differently in Egypt and > Morrocco. The phonemes are coded using linguistics conventions. At one > point, we tried to get a Nepali langauge by modifying the phonemes of > Hindu - this turned out to be beyond the capacity of some very intelligent > interns. > We could perhaps find if the contributor of Speak has added languages to > his version which we have not incorporated in Speak - but that would be a > new > version and some work. Volunteers are certainly welcome. > > I think add any language will be non trivial. Your best option should be test if ar-espeak works (there are packages available here http://rpm.pbone.net/index.php3?stat=3&search=ar-espeak&srodzaj=3) and contact the developer and espeak developers to try to have that changes included in espeak) Gonzalo > Tony > > On 08/13/2015 09:47 AM, James Cameron wrote: > >> No, not really. >> >> The documentation still needs changing for the position of the >> language selection, using the latest version of Speak, regardless of >> your problem with Arabic missing. That's what I thought you were >> suggesting with: >> >> Perhaps the Help description on Speak should be updated. >>> >> Underneath Sugar, your problem of Arabic support is that "espeak >> --voices" command doesn't list Arabic, because it is not supported in >> eSpeak: >> >> http://espeak.sourceforge.net/languages.html >> >> A quick search for espeak arabic yields Al-Mintiq and ar-espeak >> projects. Fedora doesn't have these packaged. >> >> So it looks like a challenge to add Arabic. Let us know how you go >> with that. >> >> On Thu, Aug 13, 2015 at 08:53:16AM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote: >> >>> Wouldn't it be better to make Speak work as described in the >>> documentation? >>> >>> Tony >>> On 08/13/2015 12:48 AM, James Cameron wrote: >>> >>>> Yes, please update it Tony. >>>> >>>> https://github.com/godiard/help-activity/blob/master/source/speak.rst >>>> http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Help/Contribute >>>> >>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 03:59:58PM +0200, Tony Anderson wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi, Walter >>>>> >>>>> Thanks. Sadly, that shows we don't have Arabic support in Speak. >>>>> Perhaps the >>>>> Help description on Speak should be updated. >>>>> >>>>> Tony >>>>> >>>>> On 08/12/2015 03:40 PM, Walter Bender wrote: >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 9:22 AM, Tony Anderson [1]< >>>>> tony_anderson at usa.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi, Gonzalo >>>>> >>>>> I am getting involved in a new deployment which needs Arabic >>>>> support. So I >>>>> was trying to describe what is available and what may need >>>>> some work. I >>>>> wanted >>>>> to point to the Speak activity but first wanted to check if >>>>> Arabic is one of >>>>> the languages. I was a bit surprised to find that language >>>>> selection is not >>>>> in >>>>> version 51 (13.2.5). The help activity still shows it in the >>>>> screen-shot. >>>>> >>>>> It is still there, just under the voice attributes toolbar >>>>> instead of >>>>> on the main toolbar. See attached. >>>>> >>>>> regards. >>>>> >>>>> -walter >>>>> >>>>> Tony >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>> [2]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> [3]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>> [4]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> [5]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> >>>>> References: >>>>> >>>>> [1] mailto:tony_anderson at usa.net >>>>> [2] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> [3] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> [4] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> [5] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>> >> > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -- Gonzalo Odiard SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From samsongoddy at hotmail.com Thu Aug 20 10:02:49 2015 From: samsongoddy at hotmail.com (samson goddy) Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2015 15:02:49 +0100 Subject: [Sugar-devel] FW: European Company Network 2015/2016 In-Reply-To: <0eb8aa522a74787ed7981c5feebfa0c2@localhost.localdomain> References: <0eb8aa522a74787ed7981c5feebfa0c2@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: This is a Fraud. I just did a little research on this email address and this is what i got http://www.uia.org/content/5963 Fraud Item: European Company Network Fraudulent message Date sent: Tue, 6 May 2014 From: European Company Network register at ecnreg.com Send reply to: European Company Network register at ecnreg.com Subject: European Company Network 2014/2015 Dear Madam/Sir, In order to have your company inserted in the European Company Network for 2014/2015, please print, complete and submit the attached form (PDF file) to the following address: EUROPEAN COMPANY NETWORK P.O. BOX 3079 3502 GB UTRECHT THE NETHERLANDS Fax: +31 205 248 107 Email: register at ecnreg.com Updating is free of charge! We are compiling information for the . We wish to be able to inform other companies about your activities and the languages spoken in your company. In order to list your company in the internet for european/world businesses, just fill in and return the form. Any additional material of your company that can make your profile up to date is very welcome. We thank you for your cooperation. THE SIGNING OF THIS DOCUMENT REPRESENTS THE ACCEPTANCE OF THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS AND THE CONDITIONS STATED IN "THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS FOR INSERTION" ON WEB PAGE WWW.EUROPEANCOMPANYNETWORK.COM. THE SIGNING IS LEGALLY BINDING AND GIVES YOU THE RIGHT OF AN INSERTION IN THE ONLINE DATA BASE OF THE EUROPEAN COMPANY NETWORK WHICH CAN BE ACCESSED VIA THE INTERNET, AND A CD ROM WITH WORLD BUSINESSES IS GRANTED, ALL IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE CONTRACT CONDITIONS STATED IN "THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS FOR INSERTION" ON WEB PAGE WWW.EUROPEAN COMPANY NETWORK.COM. THE VALIDATION TIME OF THE CONTRACT IS THREE YEARS AND STARTS ON THE EIGHTH DAY AFTER SIGNING THE CONTRACT. THE INSERTION IS GRANTED AFTER SIGNING AND RECEIVING THIS DOCUMENT BY THE SERVICE PROVIDER. I HEREBY ORDER A SUBSCRIPTION WITH SERVICE PROVIDER EU BUSINESS SERVICES LTD "EUROPEAN COMPANY NETWORK". I WILL HAVE AN INSERTION INTO ITS DATABASE FOR THREE YEARS. THE PRICE PER YEAR IS EURO 995. THE SUBSCRIPTION WILL BE AUTOMATICALLY EXTENDED EVERY YEAR FOR ANOTHER YEAR, UNLESS SPECIFIC WRITTEN NOTICE IS RECEIVED BY THE SERVICE PROVIDER OR THE SUBSCRIBER TWO MONTHS BEFORE THE EXPIRATION OF THE SUBSCRIPTION. YOUR DATA WILL BE RECORDED. THE PLACE OF JURISDICTION IN ANY DISPUTE ARISING IS THE SERVICE PROVIDER'S ADDRESS. THE AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE SERVICE PROVIDER AND THE SUBSCRIBER IS GOVERNED BY THE CONDITIONS STATED IN" THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS FOR INSERTION" ON WEB PAGE WWW.EUROPEANCOMPANYNETWORK.COM Please return: P.O. Box 3079, 3502 GB UTRECHT, The Netherlands, / Fax: +31 205 248 107 > Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2015 14:14:43 +0200 > To: members at sugarlabs.org > From: register at ecn-register.com > Subject: European Company Network 2015/2016 > > Madam/Sir, > > In order to have your company inserted in the European Company Network for 2015/2016, please print, complete and submit the attached form (PDF file) to the following address: > > EUROPEAN COMPANY NETWORK > PO BOX 3079 > 3502 GB UTRECHT > THE NETHERLANDS > > Fax: +31 205 248 107 > > You can also scan the completed form and attach it in a reply to this email. > > Updating is free of charge! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ECN-form.pdf Type: application/octet-stream Size: 27602 bytes Desc: not available URL: From godiard at sugarlabs.org Thu Aug 20 10:24:26 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2015 11:24:26 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speech synthesizer in sugar web In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > > Sugar however has tts built in powered by espeak. Users can highlight > speech and use a button in the frame to play it back. > > Maybe you should look into exposing the tts functions provided by sugar3 > to web activities? Then you could make an abstraction between the 2 > backends. > > You can see how the web activity communicate with sugar by example in datastore.js. You will find that use bus.js and in the case of the activity running in Sugar, use websockets. You will need add in sugar code (src/jarabe/apisocket.py) code to process a specific message (like 'sayText') and use our speech api, located in sugar-toolkit-gtk3 (src/sugar3/speech.py) Gonzalo -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From amitjha1412 at gmail.com Fri Aug 21 11:59:21 2015 From: amitjha1412 at gmail.com (Amit Kumar Jha) Date: Fri, 21 Aug 2015 21:29:21 +0530 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Blog Message-ID: Hello Everyone, It was a great summer working with you guys. I really learned a lot and hopefully have done something that may be useful to the sugar community. I'm sharing the blog which I was using this summer in an attempt to keep everyone updated. http://sugarlabs-artista.blogspot.in/ -- Thanks, Amit Kumar Jha (artista) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at sugarlabs.org Fri Aug 21 17:45:33 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Fri, 21 Aug 2015 18:45:33 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Blog In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Congratulations! Good read material Gonzalo On Fri, Aug 21, 2015 at 12:59 PM, Amit Kumar Jha wrote: > Hello Everyone, > > It was a great summer working with you guys. I really learned a lot and > hopefully have done something that may be useful to the sugar community. > > I'm sharing the blog which I was using this summer in an attempt to keep > everyone updated. > > http://sugarlabs-artista.blogspot.in/ > > -- > Thanks, > Amit Kumar Jha > (artista) > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > -- Gonzalo Odiard SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From amitjha1412 at gmail.com Fri Aug 21 17:47:47 2015 From: amitjha1412 at gmail.com (Amit Kumar Jha) Date: Sat, 22 Aug 2015 03:17:47 +0530 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Blog In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks Gonzalo. Hopefully It would be helpful to the sugar community. On Sat, Aug 22, 2015 at 3:15 AM, Gonzalo Odiard wrote: > Congratulations! > Good read material > > Gonzalo > > On Fri, Aug 21, 2015 at 12:59 PM, Amit Kumar Jha > wrote: > >> Hello Everyone, >> >> It was a great summer working with you guys. I really learned a lot and >> hopefully have done something that may be useful to the sugar community. >> >> I'm sharing the blog which I was using this summer in an attempt to keep >> everyone updated. >> >> http://sugarlabs-artista.blogspot.in/ >> >> -- >> Thanks, >> Amit Kumar Jha >> (artista) >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> >> > > > -- > Gonzalo Odiard > > SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning > -- Regards, Amit Kumar Jha -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From activities at sugarlabs.org Mon Aug 24 09:44:01 2015 From: activities at sugarlabs.org (Sugar Labs Activities) Date: Mon, 24 Aug 2015 09:44:01 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Record-101 Message-ID: <2fe58989bda88c6561fa4a2547a6b6e2@activities.sugarlabs.org> Activity Homepage: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/addon/4081 Sugar Platform: 0.96 - 0.104 Download Now: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29141/record-101.xo Release notes: Delay recording processing after shutter sound (James Cameron) Sugar Labs Activities http://activities.sugarlabs.org From ishan28mkip at gmail.com Mon Aug 24 16:27:01 2015 From: ishan28mkip at gmail.com (Ishan Sharma) Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2015 01:57:01 +0530 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Turtle3D blog, GSOC Message-ID: Hello, I am Ishan Sharma. I would like to share my GSOC blog here. https://turtle3d.wordpress.com/2015/08/24/final-update/. GSOC was a great experience and I really look forward to developing my project further into a stable activity for children intrigued by 3 dimensions :) Repo : https://github.com/ishan28mkip/turtle3D -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at sugarlabs.org Tue Aug 25 07:34:44 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2015 08:34:44 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Spanish help translation, now in help.sugarlabs.org Message-ID: Our Spanish users, now can get translated help content on help.sugarlabs.org !! Thanks Sam Parikison :) -- Gonzalo Odiard SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From walter.bender at gmail.com Tue Aug 25 11:31:40 2015 From: walter.bender at gmail.com (Walter Bender) Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2015 11:31:40 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar Digest 2015-08-25 Message-ID: ==Sugar Digest== 1. Google Summer of Code 2015 is wrapping up. The students have been writing their final blog reports, submitting last-minute patches, and uploading their code to Google. I want to take this opportunity to thank all of our students and their mentors for all their hard work this summer. (Also, thanks once more to Google for supporting this program.) Great strides along many fronts were made. Specifically, * Micha?l Ohayon worked on Web versions of some core activities for the Sugarizer project: Calculate, Paint (with collaboration, Record, and Memorize. He also submitted patches to Turtle Blocks to make it compatible with Sugarizer. Micha?l's blog [1] and git repo [2] are worth visiting. (Mentor: Lionel Laske) * Yash Khandelwal worked on Music Blocks AKA Mouse Music. This is a powerful, playful model for music in a block language. Yash's blog [3] and git repo [4] are also worth visiting. (Mentors: Devin Ulibarri and Marnen Laibow-Koser) * Ishan Sharma revisited the Turtle 3D concept, rewriting it in Javascript. His results (blog [5], demo and git repo [6]) are robust, scalable, and extensible. (Mentor: Walter) * Amit Kumar Jha worked on extensions to Turtle programming this summer. He added argument passing and return values to procedures, passing arguments to and returning values from Turtle programs so that Turtle Blocks can be used for in-line programming by all Javascript activities, and he developed a unit=test framework for Turtle Blocks JS that can be extended to all of our Javascript activities. See his blog [7] and the master Turtle Blocks JS repo [8] for more details. (Mentor: Walter) * Richa Sehgal worked on a framework to support off-line Web programming, an interactive Javascript shell. She's submitted patches to the upstream Browse activity. Meanwhile, checkout her git repository [9]. (Mentor: Tony Anderson) * Vibhor Sehgal and Utkarsh Dhawan, although not officially GSoC students, worked with Tony and Richa on a parallel project, Web Confusion, a series of programming challenges in the spirit of Turtle Confusion to encourage students. The code can be found at [10]. (Mentor: Tony Anderson) * Abhinav Anurag made some progress on a Web collaboration framework for our Javascript activities. See his blog [11] and code [12]. (Mentors: Martin Abente and Lionel Laske) === In the Community === 2. We will be holding an election for the Sugar Labs oversight board (SLOB) at the end of the calendar year. If you are interested (or know someone who is interested) in running for a board seat (all seven seats will be open), please see [13]. Also, whereas ballots are only available to "members", please offically join Sugar Labs [14]. 3. Mariah Noelle Villarreal has submitted a panel proposal, "Building Free and Open Education Communities", to the South by Southwest Conference (SXSW). The panelpicker voting period is now open until September 4th. If you have time, please vote and share [15] with any appropriate channels as well as a video that was created for the proposal [16]. 4. Sweet: Sugar contributors Mariah Noelle Villarreal and Ruben Rodriguez got married this summer!!! 5. There were three RED (Revista de Educaci?n a Distancia [17]) submissions from Sugar community members: * Going from Bits to Atoms: Programming in Turtle Blocks JS and Personal Fabrication in Youth Maker Projects, Josh Burker * Visualizing Learning in Open-Ended Problem Solving in the Arts, Walter Bender and Claudia Urrea * Sensores Tortuga 2.0: C?mo el hardware y software abiertos pueden empoderar a las comunidades de aprendizaje (Turtle Sensors 2.0: How open hardware and software empower learning communities) by Guzm?n Trinidad, Andr?s Aguirre, Alan Aguiar, Tony Forster, Walter Bender, Facundo Benavides, and Federico Andrade 6. The Sugar/OLPC program in Caacupe is expanding!!! === Tech Talk === 7. Peter Robinson announce quite some time ago that the Sugar on a Stick 21 Beta [18] is now out as part of Fedora 21 Beta (Details at [19]), but I think I neglected to ever pass on the information to the Sugar community. 8. Also worth mentioning again: Ruben Rodriguez released Trisquel 7.0 released. TOAST (Trisquel with Sugar) is an official edition [20]. === Sugar Labs === 9. Please visit our planet at [21]. ---- [1] http://sugarizingparis2015.blogspot.fr/ [2] https://github.com/mikklfr [3] https://sugarizingmusic.wordpress.com/ [4] https://github.com/ishan28mkip/turtle3D [5] https://turtle3d.wordpress.com/2015/08/24/final-update/ [6] http://ishan28mkip.github.io/turtle3D/ [7] http://sugarlabs-artista.blogspot.in/ [8] http://github.com/walterbender/turtleblocksjs/ [9] https://github.com/richaseh [10] https://github.com/sehgalvibhor/WebConfusion [11] https://summerofcode2015.wordpress.com/ [12] https://github.com/abhinavanurag18/turtleblocksjs [13] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Oversight_Board/2014-2015-candidates [14] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_Labs/Members#Applying_for_membership [15] http://panelpicker.sxsw.com/vote/48985 [16] https://youtu.be/jh_3taqRPEc [17] http://www.um.es/ead/red/46 [18] https://fedoraproject.org/get-spin-prerelease [19] https://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/announce/2014-November/003238.html [20] http://trisquel.info/en/download [21] http://planet.sugarlabs.org -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org From martin.abente.lahaye at gmail.com Wed Aug 26 11:50:57 2015 From: martin.abente.lahaye at gmail.com (Martin Abente) Date: Wed, 26 Aug 2015 11:50:57 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [Announcing] sugar and sugar-toolkit-gtk3 v0.106.1 (bug fixes release) Message-ID: Hello everyone, It's been almost two months since the release of Sugar 0.106.0, and since then we have been improving things. Many of these improvements are planned for the next major release of Sugar, but there are bug fixes that will certainly be useful for those using Sugar 0.106. Therefore, we have released sugar [1] and sugar-toolkit-gtk3 [2] v0.106.1 which include these bug fixes. The tarballs can be downloaded from: - http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/sucrose/glucose/sugar/sugar-0.106.1.tar.xz - http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/sucrose/glucose/sugar-toolkit-gtk3/sugar-toolkit-gtk3-0.106.1.tar.xz I want to take this opportunity to thank our infrastructure team for their hard work to keep things running smoothly in Sugar Labs, so thanks Sam Parkinson, Samuel Cantero, Bernie Innocenti, Sebastian Silva and Roberto Rodriguez Alcala! Martin. Refs: [1] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/commits/sucrose-0.106 [2] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar-toolkit-gtk3/commits/sucrose-0.106 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at sugarlabs.org Wed Aug 26 14:19:24 2015 From: godiard at sugarlabs.org (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Wed, 26 Aug 2015 15:19:24 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [Announcing] sugar and sugar-toolkit-gtk3 v0.106.1 (bug fixes release) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Good job, thanks Martin! On Wed, Aug 26, 2015 at 12:50 PM, Martin Abente < martin.abente.lahaye at gmail.com> wrote: > Hello everyone, > > It's been almost two months since the release of Sugar 0.106.0, and since > then we have been improving things. Many of these improvements are planned > for the next major release of Sugar, but there are bug fixes that will > certainly be useful for those using Sugar 0.106. Therefore, we have > released sugar [1] and sugar-toolkit-gtk3 [2] v0.106.1 which include these > bug fixes. > > The tarballs can be downloaded from: > > - > http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/sucrose/glucose/sugar/sugar-0.106.1.tar.xz > - > http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/sucrose/glucose/sugar-toolkit-gtk3/sugar-toolkit-gtk3-0.106.1.tar.xz > > > I want to take this opportunity to thank our infrastructure team for their > hard work to keep things running smoothly in Sugar Labs, so thanks Sam > Parkinson, Samuel Cantero, Bernie Innocenti, Sebastian Silva and Roberto > Rodriguez Alcala! > > > Martin. > > Refs: > [1] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/commits/sucrose-0.106 > [2] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar-toolkit-gtk3/commits/sucrose-0.106 > -- Gonzalo Odiard SugarLabs - Software [for | by] children learning -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gruiz at fundacionzt.org Wed Aug 26 15:32:17 2015 From: gruiz at fundacionzt.org (German Ruiz - FundacionZT) Date: Wed, 26 Aug 2015 13:32:17 -0600 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [Announcing] sugar and sugar-toolkit-gtk3 v0.106.1 (bug fixes release) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: 2015-08-26 9:50 GMT-06:00 Martin Abente : > Hello everyone, > > It's been almost two months since the release of Sugar 0.106.0, and since > then we have been improving things. Many of these improvements are planned > for the next major release of Sugar, but there are bug fixes that will > certainly be useful for those using Sugar 0.106. Therefore, we have released > sugar [1] and sugar-toolkit-gtk3 [2] v0.106.1 which include these bug fixes. > > The tarballs can be downloaded from: > > http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/sucrose/glucose/sugar/sugar-0.106.1.tar.xz > http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/sucrose/glucose/sugar-toolkit-gtk3/sugar-toolkit-gtk3-0.106.1.tar.xz > > > I want to take this opportunity to thank our infrastructure team for their > hard work to keep things running smoothly in Sugar Labs, so thanks Sam > Parkinson, Samuel Cantero, Bernie Innocenti, Sebastian Silva and Roberto > Rodriguez Alcala! > > > Martin. > > Refs: > [1] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/commits/sucrose-0.106 > [2] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar-toolkit-gtk3/commits/sucrose-0.106 Thank you Martin Here is the repo for 0.106.1 :) From lionel at olpc-france.org Thu Aug 27 11:52:58 2015 From: lionel at olpc-france.org (=?UTF-8?Q?Lionel_Lask=C3=A9?=) Date: Thu, 27 Aug 2015 17:52:58 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Speech synthesizer in sugar web (Yader Vel?squez) Message-ID: Seen lately this conversation. Just to add my 2 cents: TurtleJS [1] use the meSpeak.js [2] library to implement "Speak" block (see in Media palette). The interesting thing regarding this library is that it dynamically generate WAV audio so it don't need an Internet connection instead of other speech to text library. Don't know if it works on the XO. Hope it could help. Lionel. [1] https://turtle.sugarlabs.org/ [2] http://www.masswerk.at/mespeak/ > Date: Fri, 14 Aug 2015 19:44:46 -0600 > From: Yader Vel?squez > To: James Cameron > Cc: sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] Speech synthesizer in sugar web > Message-ID: > < > CA+pQJ9Z9Q9GgHiwhNyFTyrVywUz1spm1xTG4mZ+suLD0X1VLbQ at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Hi James, > > Yes, I know it's a browser feature, I'm following the official doc to > create > web activities[1] but neither the browser activity neither the activity > that I'm > developing have that feature :( > > I did "window.navigator" in my activity console and this is what I got: > appCodeName: "Mozilla" > appName: "Netscape" > appVersion: "5.0 (Macintosh, Intel Mac OS X ) AppleWebKit/538.1 (KHTML, > like Gecko) Safari/538.1" > > > I need synthesize spanish text in the current browser engine that sugar > uses to run web activities. > > Regards. > > > It is a feature of the browser. What browser are you using? > > > > In what way does it not work? > > > > Does the feature detection test pass? > > > > if ('speechSynthesis' in window) { > > // Synthesis support. Make your web apps talk! > > } > > > > If you use the browser to visit html5test.com does the "Speech > > Synthesis" item have a "Yes ?"? > > > > [1] https://developer.sugarlabs.org/activity.md.html > > > > -- > Yader. > http://yaderv.wordpress.com > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/attachments/20150814/89028233/attachment-0001.html > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Sat, 15 Aug 2015 12:30:39 +1000 > From: James Cameron > To: Yader Vel?squez > Cc: sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] Speech synthesizer in sugar web > Message-ID: <20150815023039.GB29172 at us.netrek.org> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Well, I don't know anything about "sugar build", I don't use it or > need it. > > But still it would be useful to identify your browser properly, try the > feature detection test, and even use the browser to visit html5test.com. > > Your "window.navigator" response tells me nothing useful; I don't know > how to reproduce it. > > The instructions [1] for setting up a development environment say you > must run Linux, but you haven't said which Linux you have run. The > browser is likely to come from there. > > 1. https://developer.sugarlabs.org/dev-environment.md.html > > -- > James Cameron > http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > End of Sugar-devel Digest, Vol 82, Issue 17 > ******************************************* > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From activities at sugarlabs.org Fri Aug 28 18:04:18 2015 From: activities at sugarlabs.org (Sugar Labs Activities) Date: Fri, 28 Aug 2015 18:04:18 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 Message-ID: <07dd6a23d3a40439ef90c20bbec2cfe1@activities.sugarlabs.org> Activity Homepage: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/addon/4774 Sugar Platform: 0.82 - 0.104 Download Now: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29142/flappy_birds-1.xo Release notes: An arcade game for sugar. Sugar Labs Activities http://activities.sugarlabs.org From quozl at laptop.org Fri Aug 28 18:47:49 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 08:47:49 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 In-Reply-To: <07dd6a23d3a40439ef90c20bbec2cfe1@activities.sugarlabs.org> References: <07dd6a23d3a40439ef90c20bbec2cfe1@activities.sugarlabs.org> Message-ID: <20150828224749.GG3276@us.netrek.org> Reviewed code and tested on XO-4 with Sugar 0.104.1, but as there was no response from the developer to my previous post on Buttons and Scissors, I don't think it is worth making any observations here. -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From alanjas at hotmail.com Fri Aug 28 23:36:52 2015 From: alanjas at hotmail.com (Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 00:36:52 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 In-Reply-To: <20150828224749.GG3276@us.netrek.org> References: <07dd6a23d3a40439ef90c20bbec2cfe1@activities.sugarlabs.org>, <20150828224749.GG3276@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: Wich problems do you have with Buttons and Scissors? > Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 08:47:49 +1000 > From: quozl at laptop.org > To: sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 > > Reviewed code and tested on XO-4 with Sugar 0.104.1, but as there was > no response from the developer to my previous post on Buttons and > Scissors, I don't think it is worth making any observations here. > > -- > James Cameron > http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sam at sam.today Fri Aug 28 23:47:01 2015 From: sam at sam.today (Sam P.) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 03:47:01 +0000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 In-Reply-To: References: <07dd6a23d3a40439ef90c20bbec2cfe1@activities.sugarlabs.org> <20150828224749.GG3276@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: Quoting Quozl: Installed on Sugar 0.104 on an OLPC XO-4. Tested. Works well. There are a few things that I'd want to fix before I added it to a deployment build: a. the activity icon is coloured, it should be in the style of other activity icons instead, so that the Sugar user colours can be applied, b. the game does not scale to the size of the screen, see attached screenshot, c. the animation seems a bit slow, it could be 50% faster, d. the scissors could open and close a bit faster, e. the touchscreen doesn't work for selecting a scissor cut, f. slipping with a cut, such that the cursor is on the home icon when the mouse is released, caused the home icon to trigger; the home icon should only trigger if both a mouse button down _and_ mouse button up event are seen within the icon borders. g. resuming the activity from the Journal did not resume the same game state. > Download Now: > http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29076/buttons_and_scissors-1.xo Is this in git anywhere? The source code is set out in a wide screen editor; it would be easier to read if it was laid out for 80 columns. The source code would benefit from pep8 and re-indentation, and removal of blank lines. There's a file in fonts/ ... is the license for this font compatible with the license for the activity? ====== You then replied Yes, the game needs more work, but for first version, it's good. The git repo is: https :// github.com / iamutkarshtiwari / Buttons- and-Scissors ====== To me, that does come across as dismissive - which seems to have been why Quozl hasn't given comments on flappy birds. Thanks, Sam On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 1:36 pm Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn wrote: > Wich problems do you have with Buttons and Scissors? > > > Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 08:47:49 +1000 > > From: quozl at laptop.org > > To: sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 > > > > > Reviewed code and tested on XO-4 with Sugar 0.104.1, but as there was > > no response from the developer to my previous post on Buttons and > > Scissors, I don't think it is worth making any observations here. > > > > -- > > James Cameron > > http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > > _______________________________________________ > > Sugar-devel mailing list > > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alanjas at hotmail.com Sat Aug 29 00:09:18 2015 From: alanjas at hotmail.com (Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 01:09:18 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 In-Reply-To: References: <07dd6a23d3a40439ef90c20bbec2cfe1@activities.sugarlabs.org>, <20150828224749.GG3276@us.netrek.org>, , Message-ID: dismissive? I don't think that was my tone.. I add the developer to the discussion.. From: sam at sam.today Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 03:47:01 +0000 To: alanjas at hotmail.com; quozl at laptop.org; sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 Quoting Quozl: Installed on Sugar 0.104 on an OLPC XO-4. Tested. Works well. There are a few things that I'd want to fix before I added it to a deployment build: a. the activity icon is coloured, it should be in the style of other activity icons instead, so that the Sugar user colours can be applied, b. the game does not scale to the size of the screen, see attached screenshot, c. the animation seems a bit slow, it could be 50% faster, d. the scissors could open and close a bit faster, e. the touchscreen doesn't work for selecting a scissor cut, f. slipping with a cut, such that the cursor is on the home icon when the mouse is released, caused the home icon to trigger; the home icon should only trigger if both a mouse button down _and_ mouse button up event are seen within the icon borders. g. resuming the activity from the Journal did not resume the same game state. > Download Now: > http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29076/buttons_and_scissors-1.xo Is this in git anywhere? The source code is set out in a wide screen editor; it would be easier to read if it was laid out for 80 columns. The source code would benefit from pep8 and re-indentation, and removal of blank lines. There's a file in fonts/ ... is the license for this font compatible with the license for the activity? ====== You then replied Yes, the game needs more work, but for first version, it's good. The git repo is: https://github.com/iamutkarshtiwari/Buttons-and-Scissors ====== To me, that does come across as dismissive - which seems to have been why Quozl hasn't given comments on flappy birds. Thanks, Sam On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 1:36 pm Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn wrote: Wich problems do you have with Buttons and Scissors? > Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 08:47:49 +1000 > From: quozl at laptop.org > To: sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 > > Reviewed code and tested on XO-4 with Sugar 0.104.1, but as there was > no response from the developer to my previous post on Buttons and > Scissors, I don't think it is worth making any observations here. > > -- > James Cameron > http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel _______________________________________________ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel _______________________________________________ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quozl at laptop.org Sat Aug 29 06:05:33 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 20:05:33 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 In-Reply-To: References: <07dd6a23d3a40439ef90c20bbec2cfe1@activities.sugarlabs.org> <20150828224749.GG3276@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: <20150829100533.GA21251@us.netrek.org> Heh. No, not dismissive. I made a thorough review and yet the code in git hasn't changed, and no new release. Makes me look silly, that's all. ;-) What was I thinking to spend so much time on it before checking if review could be used? I'm okay with over-the-wall development, where no review is wanted, but I am also willing to make constructive comments ... but if the developer isn't able to use them perhaps I should keep quiet. On Sat, Aug 29, 2015 at 01:09:18AM -0300, Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn wrote: > > dismissive? I don't think that was my tone.. > > I add the developer to the discussion.. > > ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? > From: sam at sam.today > Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 03:47:01 +0000 > To: alanjas at hotmail.com; quozl at laptop.org; sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 > > Quoting Quozl: > > Installed on Sugar 0.104 on an OLPC XO-4. Tested. Works well. There > are a few things that I'd want to fix before I added it to a > deployment build: > > a. the activity icon is coloured, it should be in the style of other > activity icons instead, so that the Sugar user colours can be applied, > > b. the game does not scale to the size of the screen, see attached > screenshot, > > c. the animation seems a bit slow, it could be 50% faster, > > d. the scissors could open and close a bit faster, > > e. the touchscreen doesn't work for selecting a scissor cut, > > f. slipping with a cut, such that the cursor is on the home icon when > the mouse is released, caused the home icon to trigger; the home icon > should only trigger if both a mouse button down _and_ mouse button up > event are seen within the icon borders. > > g. resuming the activity from the Journal did not resume the same > game state. > > > Download Now: > > [1]http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29076/ > buttons_and_scissors-1.xo > > Is this in git anywhere? > > The source code is set out in a wide screen editor; it would be easier > to read if it was laid out for 80 columns. > > The source code would benefit from pep8 and re-indentation, and > removal of blank lines. > > There's a file in fonts/ ... is the license for this font compatible > with the license for the activity? > > ====== > > You then replied > > Yes, the game needs more work, but for first version, it's good. > > The git repo is: [2]https[3]://[4]github.com[5]/[6]iamutkarshtiwari[7]/[8] > Buttons-[9]and-Scissors > > ====== > > To me, that does come across as dismissive - which seems to have been why Quozl > hasn't given comments on flappy birds. > > Thanks, > Sam > > On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 1:36 pm Alan Jhonn Aguiar Schwyn <[10]alanjas at hotmail.com> > wrote: > > Wich problems do you have with Buttons and Scissors? > > > Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 08:47:49 +1000 > > From: [11]quozl at laptop.org > > To: [12]sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > Subject: Re: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Flappy Birds-1 > > > > > Reviewed code and tested on XO-4 with Sugar 0.104.1, but as there was > > no response from the developer to my previous post on Buttons and > > Scissors, I don't think it is worth making any observations here. > > > > -- > > James Cameron > > [13]http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > > _______________________________________________ > > Sugar-devel mailing list > > [14]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > [15]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > [16]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [17]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > _______________________________________________ Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > References: > > [1] http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29076/buttons_and_scissors-1.xo > [2] https://github.com/iamutkarshtiwari/Buttons-and-Scissors > [3] https://github.com/iamutkarshtiwari/Buttons-and-Scissors > [4] https://github.com/iamutkarshtiwari/Buttons-and-Scissors > [5] https://github.com/iamutkarshtiwari/Buttons-and-Scissors > [6] https://github.com/iamutkarshtiwari/Buttons-and-Scissors > [7] https://github.com/iamutkarshtiwari/Buttons-and-Scissors > [8] https://github.com/iamutkarshtiwari/Buttons-and-Scissors > [9] https://github.com/iamutkarshtiwari/Buttons-and-Scissors > [10] mailto:alanjas at hotmail.com > [11] mailto:quozl at laptop.org > [12] mailto:sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [13] http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > [14] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [15] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > [16] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [17] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From tony_anderson at usa.net Sat Aug 29 06:12:49 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 12:12:49 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow Message-ID: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> I use sugar-install-bundle to update the configuration of Sugar activities when preparing laptops at deployments. With 13.2.5, this script is taking 3-4 times as long as with previous releases. I can only speculate on the difference in times since I have 13.2.5 on all the available XOs and apparently can't flash back. Specifically, Browse (some custom modifications) Test 1: 23 minutes 34 seconds Test 2: 5 minutes 21 seconds Jukebox (v26 - need gstream 0.1) Test 1: 19 minutes 26 seconds Test 2: 7 minutes 39 seconds Quiz Test 1 6 minutes 52 seconds Test 2 3 minutes 18 seconds My recollection is that the install on 13.2.1 took less than 10 minutes overall (including a number of other installs such as codecs, flash, libre office, gcompris ) with installation of these three activities taking from 2-3 minutes total. Tony From sam at sam.today Sat Aug 29 06:17:13 2015 From: sam at sam.today (Sam P.) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 10:17:13 +0000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> Message-ID: Hi Tony, Do you have the logs of these installs? Is there anything in the logs? Looking back at the commit logs, the change in 0.104 was to use the bundle registry to install bundles if sugar is running [1]. Maybe that has done something or maybe it is a different change down the line! Thanks, Sam [1] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/commit/64b4b2fba1c37a9ad92ed30eb669b68552b62415 On Sat, Aug 29, 2015 at 8:13 PM Tony Anderson wrote: > I use sugar-install-bundle to update the configuration of Sugar > activities when preparing laptops at deployments. With 13.2.5, this > script is taking 3-4 times as long > as with previous releases. > > I can only speculate on the difference in times since I have 13.2.5 on > all the available XOs and apparently can't flash back. > > Specifically, > > Browse (some custom modifications) Test 1: 23 minutes 34 seconds Test > 2: 5 minutes 21 seconds > Jukebox (v26 - need gstream 0.1) Test 1: 19 minutes 26 seconds Test 2: 7 > minutes 39 seconds > Quiz Test 1 6 minutes 52 seconds Test 2 3 minutes 18 seconds > > My recollection is that the install on 13.2.1 took less than 10 minutes > overall (including a number of other installs such as codecs, flash, > libre office, gcompris ) with > installation of these three activities taking from 2-3 minutes total. > > Tony > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tony_anderson at usa.net Sat Aug 29 06:43:49 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 12:43:49 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> Message-ID: <55E18CE5.1070108@usa.net> Hi, Sam P. The logs are not interesting, only the unzip list of files. The second test used time.time() in sugar-install-bundle. It is going through the bundle registry. There is an else option. Perhaps I should try the installs with that branch. Tony On 08/29/2015 12:17 PM, Sam P. wrote: > Hi Tony, > > Do you have the logs of these installs? Is there anything in the logs? > > Looking back at the commit logs, the change in 0.104 was to use the > bundle registry to install bundles if sugar is running [1]. Maybe > that has done something or maybe it is a different change down the line! > > Thanks, > Sam > > [1] > https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/commit/64b4b2fba1c37a9ad92ed30eb669b68552b62415 > > On Sat, Aug 29, 2015 at 8:13 PM Tony Anderson > wrote: > > I use sugar-install-bundle to update the configuration of Sugar > activities when preparing laptops at deployments. With 13.2.5, this > script is taking 3-4 times as long > as with previous releases. > > I can only speculate on the difference in times since I have 13.2.5 on > all the available XOs and apparently can't flash back. > > Specifically, > > Browse (some custom modifications) Test 1: 23 minutes 34 seconds Test > 2: 5 minutes 21 seconds > Jukebox (v26 - need gstream 0.1) Test 1: 19 minutes 26 seconds > Test 2: 7 > minutes 39 seconds > Quiz Test 1 6 minutes 52 seconds Test 2 3 minutes 18 seconds > > My recollection is that the install on 13.2.1 took less than 10 > minutes > overall (including a number of other installs such as codecs, flash, > libre office, gcompris ) with > installation of these three activities taking from 2-3 minutes total. > > Tony > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From me at jvonau.ca Sat Aug 29 07:42:04 2015 From: me at jvonau.ca (Jerry Vonau) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 06:42:04 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: <55E18CE5.1070108@usa.net> References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> <55E18CE5.1070108@usa.net> Message-ID: <1715931491.191136.1440848524677.JavaMail.open-xchange@bosoxweb04.eigbox.net> Hi Tony, I brought concerns about that change, with regards to OSbuilder but I guess that change is slowing down the console now. Have you tried TinyCore[1] that would boot without setting having SUGAR_PROFILE. I've used TinyCore to install activities in the past, checkout XO.custom in the source code. Not sure what effect changing SUGAR_PROFILE might have while sugar is running but maybe booting to whatever they call runlevel 3(without the gui) might be an alternative. You'd have to mount the usbkey by hand, but that should work. Hope that helps, Jerry 1. http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Tiny_Core_Linux > On August 29, 2015 at 5:43 AM Tony Anderson > wrote: > > > Hi, Sam P. > > The logs are not interesting, only the unzip list of files. The second > test used time.time() in sugar-install-bundle. It is going through the > bundle registry. There is > an else option. Perhaps I should try the installs with that branch. > > Tony > > On 08/29/2015 12:17 PM, Sam P. wrote: > > Hi Tony, > > > > Do you have the logs of these installs? Is there anything in the logs? > > > > Looking back at the commit logs, the change in 0.104 was to use the > > bundle registry to install bundles if sugar is running [1]. Maybe > > that has done something or maybe it is a different change down the > > line! > > > > Thanks, > > Sam > > > > [1] > > https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/commit/64b4b2fba1c37a9ad92ed30eb669b68552b62415 > > > > On Sat, Aug 29, 2015 at 8:13 PM Tony Anderson > > wrote: > > > > I use sugar-install-bundle to update the configuration of Sugar > > activities when preparing laptops at deployments. With 13.2.5, this > > script is taking 3-4 times as long > > as with previous releases. > > > > I can only speculate on the difference in times since I have 13.2.5 > > on > > all the available XOs and apparently can't flash back. > > > > Specifically, > > > > Browse (some custom modifications) Test 1: 23 minutes 34 seconds > > Test > > 2: 5 minutes 21 seconds > > Jukebox (v26 - need gstream 0.1) Test 1: 19 minutes 26 seconds > > Test 2: 7 > > minutes 39 seconds > > Quiz Test 1 6 minutes 52 seconds Test 2 3 minutes 18 seconds > > > > My recollection is that the install on 13.2.1 took less than 10 > > minutes > > overall (including a number of other installs such as codecs, > > flash, > > libre office, gcompris ) with > > installation of these three activities taking from 2-3 minutes > > total. > > > > Tony > > _______________________________________________ > > Sugar-devel mailing list > > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Sugar-devel mailing list > > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel From quozl at laptop.org Sat Aug 29 07:41:55 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 21:41:55 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> Message-ID: <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> G'day Sam, My guess is #4849 again and our user hasn't unset the SUGAR_PROFILE environment variable as was suggested four months ago. I never heard closure on the suggestion, but as it was off-list I'm not surprised. The ticket shows how to reproduce in case you'd like to take a stab at it. -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From tony_anderson at usa.net Sat Aug 29 09:51:27 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 15:51:27 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: <55E1B8DF.2000508@usa.net> Hi, I reran the installs with SUGAR_PROFILE set to False. The install timings: Browse: 0.5 seconds Jukebox: 0.5 seconds Quiz: 0.8 seconds I'll just patch sugar-install-bundle not to use the SUGAR_PROFILE path. Thanks for the help. Tony On 08/29/2015 01:41 PM, James Cameron wrote: > G'day Sam, > > My guess is #4849 again and our user hasn't unset the SUGAR_PROFILE > environment variable as was suggested four months ago. I never heard > closure on the suggestion, but as it was off-list I'm not surprised. > The ticket shows how to reproduce in case you'd like to take a stab at > it. > From sam at sam.today Sat Aug 29 17:18:08 2015 From: sam at sam.today (Sam P.) Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2015 21:18:08 +0000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: <55E1B8DF.2000508@usa.net> References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> <55E1B8DF.2000508@usa.net> Message-ID: Hi Tony, Should we make disabling install via bundle registry (SUGAR_PROFILE) a flag? There are use cases when it makes sense to install via bundle registry (updating the activity list) so it is not good to outright disable it. Thanks, Sam On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 11:51 pm Tony Anderson wrote: > Hi, > > I reran the installs with SUGAR_PROFILE set to False. The install timings: > > Browse: 0.5 seconds > Jukebox: 0.5 seconds > Quiz: 0.8 seconds > > I'll just patch sugar-install-bundle not to use the SUGAR_PROFILE path. > > Thanks for the help. > > Tony > > On 08/29/2015 01:41 PM, James Cameron wrote: > > G'day Sam, > > > > My guess is #4849 again and our user hasn't unset the SUGAR_PROFILE > > environment variable as was suggested four months ago. I never heard > > closure on the suggestion, but as it was off-list I'm not surprised. > > The ticket shows how to reproduce in case you'd like to take a stab at > > it. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tony_anderson at usa.net Sun Aug 30 01:43:10 2015 From: tony_anderson at usa.net (Tony Anderson) Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2015 07:43:10 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> <55E1B8DF.2000508@usa.net> Message-ID: <55E297EE.4050706@usa.net> Hi, Sam The script that installs these activities is run after flashing the laptop to provide the capabilities needed for the laptop to work with the school server. The goal is to have each laptop in the deployment with identical software. In this case, the script finishes by a poweroff command. This means the laptop will be rebooted. At least in all previous releases the system registers the activities in the Activities folder. However, I am concerned that activities installed from the school server will also be affected. If so, it may be fixable with a patch to the Browse activity. Then it may be necessary for the user to reboot to register the activity. (Sad was the day we lost the three-finger salute!). Obviously, the best solution is to fix the problem. The above are, at best, workarounds. Tony On 08/29/2015 11:18 PM, Sam P. wrote: > > Hi Tony, > > Should we make disabling install via bundle registry (SUGAR_PROFILE) a > flag? > > There are use cases when it makes sense to install via bundle registry > (updating the activity list) so it is not good to outright disable it. > > Thanks, > Sam > > > On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 11:51 pm Tony Anderson > wrote: > > Hi, > > I reran the installs with SUGAR_PROFILE set to False. The install > timings: > > Browse: 0.5 seconds > Jukebox: 0.5 seconds > Quiz: 0.8 seconds > > I'll just patch sugar-install-bundle not to use the SUGAR_PROFILE > path. > > Thanks for the help. > > Tony > > On 08/29/2015 01:41 PM, James Cameron wrote: > > G'day Sam, > > > > My guess is #4849 again and our user hasn't unset the SUGAR_PROFILE > > environment variable as was suggested four months ago. I never > heard > > closure on the suggestion, but as it was off-list I'm not surprised. > > The ticket shows how to reproduce in case you'd like to take a > stab at > > it. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lionel at olpc-france.org Sun Aug 30 03:44:30 2015 From: lionel at olpc-france.org (=?UTF-8?Q?Lionel_Lask=C3=A9?=) Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2015 09:44:30 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Spell checker, Grammar checker for Write Message-ID: Hi all, An OLPC France teacher working on our small XO-4 deployment asked me if it's possible to enhance Write activity with a spell checker, grammar checker or a dictionary (all in French). I reminded me that Write activity is based on AbiWord and it seems that AbiWord allow some sort of plug-ins. Do you know if it's possible to enhance Write with AbiWord plugins ? Is there someone that experience this sort of thing ? Tell me. Best regards from France. Lionel. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sam at sam.today Sun Aug 30 03:46:50 2015 From: sam at sam.today (Sam P.) Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2015 07:46:50 +0000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Spell checker, Grammar checker for Write In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Lionel, I think it is an abiword config thing. On my Fedora laptop, both abiword and Write Activity have a spell checker. I don't think you need a plugin. Thanks, Sam On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 5:44 PM Lionel Lask? wrote: > Hi all, > > An OLPC France teacher working on our small XO-4 deployment asked me if > it's possible to enhance Write activity with a spell checker, grammar > checker or a dictionary (all in French). > > I reminded me that Write activity is based on AbiWord and it seems that > AbiWord allow some sort of plug-ins. > > Do you know if it's possible to enhance Write with AbiWord plugins ? > Is there someone that experience this sort of thing ? > > Tell me. > > Best regards from France. > > Lionel. > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From me at jvonau.ca Sun Aug 30 07:30:13 2015 From: me at jvonau.ca (Jerry Vonau) Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2015 06:30:13 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [Sugar-devel] Spell checker, Grammar checker for Write In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <812076376.232218.1440934213495.JavaMail.open-xchange@bosoxweb04.eigbox.net> Hi Sam, > On August 30, 2015 at 2:46 AM "Sam P." wrote: > > > Hi Lionel, > > I think it is an abiword config thing. On my Fedora laptop, both abiword > and Write Activity have a spell checker. I don't think you need a > plugin. > In this case perhaps a dictionary needs to be installed for the language in use. There was a wiki page somewhere about that, just don't recall where. You can not make that "it is just a config thing" assumption when it comes to Fedora on "something else" versus "XO's" where some of the rpm packages have been altered[1][2]. You are on the right path when checking the .spec file in the src.rpm for patches that are applied versus patches in the src.rpm that is available in Fedora proper just to see what can differ. Think there was some speed issue involved or was it some clipboard issue with other rpm patched for gtk3 at the time. Jerry 1. http://mock.laptop.org/cgit/local.13.2.5/tree/SRPMS 2. http://rpmdropbox.laptop.org/ > Thanks, > Sam > > On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 5:44 PM Lionel Lask? > wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > An OLPC France teacher working on our small XO-4 deployment asked me if > > it's possible to enhance Write activity with a spell checker, grammar > > checker or a dictionary (all in French). > > > > I reminded me that Write activity is based on AbiWord and it seems that > > AbiWord allow some sort of plug-ins. > > > > Do you know if it's possible to enhance Write with AbiWord plugins ? > > Is there someone that experience this sort of thing ? > > > > Tell me. > > > > Best regards from France. > > > > Lionel. > > _______________________________________________ > > Sugar-devel mailing list > > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel From quozl at laptop.org Sun Aug 30 18:34:28 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2015 08:34:28 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> <55E1B8DF.2000508@usa.net> Message-ID: <20150830223428.GB4628@us.netrek.org> G'day Sam, Adding a flag for a workaround seems like you've given up. ;-) Wouldn't it be better to fix the problem? As you can see from #4849 it occurs in Sugar, and only inside Terminal activity. Why is it happening? Why does it take up to 24 minutes to install Browse using Terminal? Why does it take up to 5 minutes to install in Sugar 0.98? And yet only half a second if the bundle registry is bypassed? The bundle registry can't be that slow. By understanding the problem we'll be able to say whether it is causing any other slowness of Sugar. -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ From godiard at gmail.com Mon Aug 31 08:28:09 2015 From: godiard at gmail.com (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2015 09:28:09 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Spell checker, Grammar checker for Write In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Lionel, The spell checker on Write was disable due to bug http://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4124 To enable, you need edit the file /home/olpc/Activities/Write.activity/keybindings.xml and remove the line: If that do not work you need check: * if the abiword rpm in your image was compiled with the option --disable-spell or not (a good test could be run abiword in the terminal and check if you can enable spell check) * you need check if a dictionary for French is needed. Abiword can use aspell or ispell dictionaries http://www.abisource.com/help/en-US/info/infospelling.html Tell us the result of your test in your environment, maybe is time of enable the feature again. Gonzalo On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 4:44 AM, Lionel Lask? wrote: > Hi all, > > An OLPC France teacher working on our small XO-4 deployment asked me if > it's possible to enhance Write activity with a spell checker, grammar > checker or a dictionary (all in French). > > I reminded me that Write activity is based on AbiWord and it seems that > AbiWord allow some sort of plug-ins. > > Do you know if it's possible to enhance Write with AbiWord plugins ? > Is there someone that experience this sort of thing ? > > Tell me. > > Best regards from France. > > Lionel. > > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > -- Gonzalo Odiard -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at gmail.com Mon Aug 31 09:00:54 2015 From: godiard at gmail.com (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2015 10:00:54 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: <20150830223428.GB4628@us.netrek.org> References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> <55E1B8DF.2000508@usa.net> <20150830223428.GB4628@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: Tony, If you can enable logging (remove the comment in the line SUGAR_LOGGER_LEVEL in the file /home/olpc/.sugar/default/debug) And install one of the activities without unset the SUGAR_PROFILE env variable, and send the log, maybe we can understand better what is happening. I am afraid the slowness will impact Browse even if you patch it, because Browse process run in a environment with the env variable set. One more question: the time is bigger in slower devices (XO-1) than in XO-4, or is independent of the hardware performance? Gonzalo On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 7:34 PM, James Cameron wrote: > G'day Sam, > > Adding a flag for a workaround seems like you've given up. ;-) > > Wouldn't it be better to fix the problem? As you can see from > #4849 it occurs in Sugar, and only inside Terminal activity. > > Why is it happening? > > Why does it take up to 24 minutes to install Browse using Terminal? > > Why does it take up to 5 minutes to install in Sugar 0.98? > > And yet only half a second if the bundle registry is bypassed? > > The bundle registry can't be that slow. > > By understanding the problem we'll be able to say whether it is > causing any other slowness of Sugar. > > -- > James Cameron > http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > -- Gonzalo Odiard -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at gmail.com Mon Aug 31 09:02:47 2015 From: godiard at gmail.com (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2015 10:02:47 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> <55E1B8DF.2000508@usa.net> <20150830223428.GB4628@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: I am wondering if this issue ca be related to the race condition detected by Martin when the file monitor detect the activity before the activity.info file is saved to disk. Martin, do you have a patch to test? Gonzalo On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 10:00 AM, Gonzalo Odiard wrote: > Tony, > If you can enable logging (remove the comment in the line > SUGAR_LOGGER_LEVEL > in the file /home/olpc/.sugar/default/debug) > And install one of the activities without unset the SUGAR_PROFILE env > variable, > and send the log, maybe we can understand better what is happening. > > I am afraid the slowness will impact Browse even if you patch it, because > Browse process > run in a environment with the env variable set. > > One more question: the time is bigger in slower devices (XO-1) than in > XO-4, > or is independent of the hardware performance? > > Gonzalo > > > On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 7:34 PM, James Cameron wrote: > >> G'day Sam, >> >> Adding a flag for a workaround seems like you've given up. ;-) >> >> Wouldn't it be better to fix the problem? As you can see from >> #4849 it occurs in Sugar, and only inside Terminal activity. >> >> Why is it happening? >> >> Why does it take up to 24 minutes to install Browse using Terminal? >> >> Why does it take up to 5 minutes to install in Sugar 0.98? >> >> And yet only half a second if the bundle registry is bypassed? >> >> The bundle registry can't be that slow. >> >> By understanding the problem we'll be able to say whether it is >> causing any other slowness of Sugar. >> >> -- >> James Cameron >> http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> > > > > -- > Gonzalo Odiard > > -- Gonzalo Odiard -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From activities at sugarlabs.org Mon Aug 31 12:15:31 2015 From: activities at sugarlabs.org (Sugar Labs Activities) Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2015 12:15:31 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] [ASLO] Release Record-102 Message-ID: <005360ae31265862c83252f7bde66352@activities.sugarlabs.org> Activity Homepage: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/addon/4081 Sugar Platform: 0.92 - 0.104 Download Now: http://activities.sugarlabs.org/downloads/file/29143/record-102.xo Release notes: Extend hardware detection (James Cameron) Set Analog Mic Boost control on XO-{1.75,4} (James Cameron) Sugar Labs Activities http://activities.sugarlabs.org From martin.abente.lahaye at gmail.com Mon Aug 31 13:03:19 2015 From: martin.abente.lahaye at gmail.com (Martin Abente) Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2015 13:03:19 -0400 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> <55E1B8DF.2000508@usa.net> <20150830223428.GB4628@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: The problem caused by the race condition is that the activities were not refreshed in Sugar activities list when updated or, not added to the list when installed. By race condition I mean the situation where the BundleRegistry detects changes (e.g. in ~/Activities) too early, when activity.info is not available yet, so the bundle gets ignored. I personally don't think is related to this issue. Now, looking at Tony's report and Sam's confirmation that this issue is related to the change in [1], my first guess would be that the problem is caused by the overhead generated by initializing the BundleRegistry, and any other sugar module imported by it, every time the sugar-install-bundle script is executed. Note that the script runs in a different process than the sugar shell, so the registry instance returned by get_registry() is not the same one as the one in the shell. Having SUGAR_PROFILE set doesn't necessarily mean the script is being executed in the same context as the shell. If my guess is confirmed, we should revise that change or revert it. Refs: 1. https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/commit/64b4b2fba1c37a9ad92ed30eb669b68552b62415 On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 9:02 AM, Gonzalo Odiard wrote: > I am wondering if this issue ca be related to the race condition detected > by Martin when the file monitor detect the activity before the > activity.info file > is saved to disk. > > Martin, do you have a patch to test? > > Gonzalo > > On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 10:00 AM, Gonzalo Odiard > wrote: > >> Tony, >> If you can enable logging (remove the comment in the line >> SUGAR_LOGGER_LEVEL >> in the file /home/olpc/.sugar/default/debug) >> And install one of the activities without unset the SUGAR_PROFILE env >> variable, >> and send the log, maybe we can understand better what is happening. >> >> I am afraid the slowness will impact Browse even if you patch it, because >> Browse process >> run in a environment with the env variable set. >> >> One more question: the time is bigger in slower devices (XO-1) than in >> XO-4, >> or is independent of the hardware performance? >> >> Gonzalo >> >> >> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 7:34 PM, James Cameron wrote: >> >>> G'day Sam, >>> >>> Adding a flag for a workaround seems like you've given up. ;-) >>> >>> Wouldn't it be better to fix the problem? As you can see from >>> #4849 it occurs in Sugar, and only inside Terminal activity. >>> >>> Why is it happening? >>> >>> Why does it take up to 24 minutes to install Browse using Terminal? >>> >>> Why does it take up to 5 minutes to install in Sugar 0.98? >>> >>> And yet only half a second if the bundle registry is bypassed? >>> >>> The bundle registry can't be that slow. >>> >>> By understanding the problem we'll be able to say whether it is >>> causing any other slowness of Sugar. >>> >>> -- >>> James Cameron >>> http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Gonzalo Odiard >> >> > > > -- > Gonzalo Odiard > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at gmail.com Mon Aug 31 14:53:09 2015 From: godiard at gmail.com (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2015 15:53:09 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> <55E1B8DF.2000508@usa.net> <20150830223428.GB4628@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: Is a good point. Maybe we should add a dbus method to register a bundle, and a method in the toolkit to do the call, then this script use that method. I didn't realized this before, because is included in the sugar module, but we should not use jarabe here. Gonzalo On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 2:03 PM, Martin Abente < martin.abente.lahaye at gmail.com> wrote: > The problem caused by the race condition is that the activities were not > refreshed in Sugar activities list when updated or, not added to the list > when installed. By race condition I mean the situation where the > BundleRegistry detects changes (e.g. in ~/Activities) too early, when > activity.info is not available yet, so the bundle gets ignored. I > personally don't think is related to this issue. > > Now, looking at Tony's report and Sam's confirmation that this issue is > related to the change in [1], my first guess would be that the problem is > caused by the overhead generated by initializing the BundleRegistry, and > any other sugar module imported by it, every time the sugar-install-bundle > script is executed. Note that the script runs in a different process than > the sugar shell, so the registry instance returned by get_registry() is not > the same one as the one in the shell. Having SUGAR_PROFILE set doesn't > necessarily mean the script is being executed in the same context as the > shell. > > If my guess is confirmed, we should revise that change or revert it. > > Refs: > 1. > https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/commit/64b4b2fba1c37a9ad92ed30eb669b68552b62415 > > On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 9:02 AM, Gonzalo Odiard wrote: > >> I am wondering if this issue ca be related to the race condition detected >> by Martin when the file monitor detect the activity before the >> activity.info file >> is saved to disk. >> >> Martin, do you have a patch to test? >> >> Gonzalo >> >> On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 10:00 AM, Gonzalo Odiard >> wrote: >> >>> Tony, >>> If you can enable logging (remove the comment in the line >>> SUGAR_LOGGER_LEVEL >>> in the file /home/olpc/.sugar/default/debug) >>> And install one of the activities without unset the SUGAR_PROFILE env >>> variable, >>> and send the log, maybe we can understand better what is happening. >>> >>> I am afraid the slowness will impact Browse even if you patch it, >>> because Browse process >>> run in a environment with the env variable set. >>> >>> One more question: the time is bigger in slower devices (XO-1) than in >>> XO-4, >>> or is independent of the hardware performance? >>> >>> Gonzalo >>> >>> >>> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 7:34 PM, James Cameron wrote: >>> >>>> G'day Sam, >>>> >>>> Adding a flag for a workaround seems like you've given up. ;-) >>>> >>>> Wouldn't it be better to fix the problem? As you can see from >>>> #4849 it occurs in Sugar, and only inside Terminal activity. >>>> >>>> Why is it happening? >>>> >>>> Why does it take up to 24 minutes to install Browse using Terminal? >>>> >>>> Why does it take up to 5 minutes to install in Sugar 0.98? >>>> >>>> And yet only half a second if the bundle registry is bypassed? >>>> >>>> The bundle registry can't be that slow. >>>> >>>> By understanding the problem we'll be able to say whether it is >>>> causing any other slowness of Sugar. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> James Cameron >>>> http://quozl.linux.org.au/ >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Gonzalo Odiard >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Gonzalo Odiard >> >> > -- Gonzalo Odiard -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lionel at olpc-france.org Mon Aug 31 16:11:55 2015 From: lionel at olpc-france.org (=?UTF-8?Q?Lionel_Lask=C3=A9?=) Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2015 22:11:55 +0200 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Spell checker, Grammar checker for Write In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi all, Thanks Sam and Jerry for advice. Thanks Gonzalo for this very detailed answer. I've tested it on a XO-4 with 0.106. I've removed the line you mentioned in keybindings.xml file but without any result neither in Write activity (tested in v96 and v82) neither in abiword. Guess it means that --disable-spell was used at compilation time. Is there a place where I could download another binary/rpm with the spell enable ? Lionel. 2015-08-31 14:28 GMT+02:00 Gonzalo Odiard : > Hi Lionel, > > The spell checker on Write was disable due to bug > http://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4124 > > To enable, you need edit the file > /home/olpc/Activities/Write.activity/keybindings.xml > and remove the line: > > > If that do not work you need check: > * if the abiword rpm in your image was compiled with the option > --disable-spell or not > (a good test could be run abiword in the terminal and check if you can > enable spell check) > * you need check if a dictionary for French is needed. > Abiword can use aspell or ispell dictionaries > http://www.abisource.com/help/en-US/info/infospelling.html > > Tell us the result of your test in your environment, > maybe is time of enable the feature again. > > Gonzalo > > > On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 4:44 AM, Lionel Lask? > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> An OLPC France teacher working on our small XO-4 deployment asked me if >> it's possible to enhance Write activity with a spell checker, grammar >> checker or a dictionary (all in French). >> >> I reminded me that Write activity is based on AbiWord and it seems that >> AbiWord allow some sort of plug-ins. >> >> Do you know if it's possible to enhance Write with AbiWord plugins ? >> Is there someone that experience this sort of thing ? >> >> Tell me. >> >> Best regards from France. >> >> Lionel. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sugar-devel mailing list >> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >> >> > > > -- > Gonzalo Odiard > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From godiard at gmail.com Mon Aug 31 16:33:04 2015 From: godiard at gmail.com (Gonzalo Odiard) Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2015 17:33:04 -0300 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Spell checker, Grammar checker for Write In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: You can try http://dev.laptop.org/~gonzalo/abiword-with-spell-checking-enabled.zip (for arm) for xo-1, xo-1.5, you need recompile the abiword rpm. We have a spec and patches, but mostly are changes needed to support touch in the XO-4 [1] Maybe you can try using a standard fedora rpm for 32 bits. [1] https://github.com/godiard/olpc-abiword-rpm Gonzalo On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 5:11 PM, Lionel Lask? wrote: > Hi all, > > Thanks Sam and Jerry for advice. > Thanks Gonzalo for this very detailed answer. > > I've tested it on a XO-4 with 0.106. > I've removed the line you mentioned in keybindings.xml file but without > any result neither in Write activity (tested in v96 and v82) neither in > abiword. > Guess it means that --disable-spell was used at compilation time. > Is there a place where I could download another binary/rpm with the spell > enable ? > > Lionel. > > > > 2015-08-31 14:28 GMT+02:00 Gonzalo Odiard : > >> Hi Lionel, >> >> The spell checker on Write was disable due to bug >> http://bugs.sugarlabs.org/ticket/4124 >> >> To enable, you need edit the file >> /home/olpc/Activities/Write.activity/keybindings.xml >> and remove the line: >> >> >> If that do not work you need check: >> * if the abiword rpm in your image was compiled with the option >> --disable-spell or not >> (a good test could be run abiword in the terminal and check if you can >> enable spell check) >> * you need check if a dictionary for French is needed. >> Abiword can use aspell or ispell dictionaries >> http://www.abisource.com/help/en-US/info/infospelling.html >> >> Tell us the result of your test in your environment, >> maybe is time of enable the feature again. >> >> Gonzalo >> >> >> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 4:44 AM, Lionel Lask? >> wrote: >> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> An OLPC France teacher working on our small XO-4 deployment asked me if >>> it's possible to enhance Write activity with a spell checker, grammar >>> checker or a dictionary (all in French). >>> >>> I reminded me that Write activity is based on AbiWord and it seems that >>> AbiWord allow some sort of plug-ins. >>> >>> Do you know if it's possible to enhance Write with AbiWord plugins ? >>> Is there someone that experience this sort of thing ? >>> >>> Tell me. >>> >>> Best regards from France. >>> >>> Lionel. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org >>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Gonzalo Odiard >> >> > -- Gonzalo Odiard -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From quozl at laptop.org Mon Aug 31 20:26:36 2015 From: quozl at laptop.org (James Cameron) Date: Tue, 1 Sep 2015 10:26:36 +1000 Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar-install-bundle in 13.2.5 is slooow In-Reply-To: References: <55E185A1.1060709@usa.net> <20150829114155.GA23669@us.netrek.org> <55E1B8DF.2000508@usa.net> <20150830223428.GB4628@us.netrek.org> Message-ID: <20150901002636.GC1329@us.netrek.org> I agree, that might be good. An strace of sugar-bundle-install shows the huge amount of work required to start this other instance of the bundle registry, only to dismantle it on exit. Alternatively, if there were a method by which sugar-bundle-install could tell the shell that a new bundle has been installed, there would be no need to use the bundle registry at all. This ties in with a recent discussion about how the shell detects activities installed by a system package manager. Currently an Gio inotify watch is used, and it suffers from a race condition. It is overkill compared to a simple notification or signal. Also, if we trust the Gio inotify watch so much, why are we bothering with the registry in sugar-bundle-install anyway? Could we please switch to a SIGHUP handler and a PID file? diff --git a/bin/sugar-install-bundle b/bin/sugar-install-bundle index 426c220..b5580bb 100644 --- a/bin/sugar-install-bundle +++ b/bin/sugar-install-bundle @@ -4,10 +4,6 @@ import sys from sugar3.bundle.activitybundle import ActivityBundle -from dbus.mainloop.glib import DBusGMainLoop -DBusGMainLoop(set_as_default=True) - - def cmd_help(): print 'Usage: sugar-install-bundle [ bundlename ] \n\n\ Install an activity bundle (.xo). \n' @@ -16,15 +12,7 @@ if len(sys.argv) != 2: cmd_help() sys.exit(2) -if 'SUGAR_PROFILE' in os.environ: - # We are in sugar, so use the bundle registry so the correct signals - # are sent to the activity list - from jarabe.model.bundleregistry import get_registry - registry = get_registry() - bundle = ActivityBundle(sys.argv[1]) - registry.install(bundle, force_downgrade=True) -else: - bundle = ActivityBundle(sys.argv[1]) - bundle.install() +bundle = ActivityBundle(sys.argv[1]) +bundle.install() print "%s: '%s' installed." % (sys.argv[0], sys.argv[1]) On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 03:53:09PM -0300, Gonzalo Odiard wrote: > Is a good point. > Maybe we should add a dbus method to register a bundle, > and a method in the toolkit to do the call, > then this script use that method. > I didn't realized this before, because is included in the sugar module, > but we should not use jarabe here. > > Gonzalo > > On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 2:03 PM, Martin Abente <[1] > martin.abente.lahaye at gmail.com> wrote: > > The problem caused by the race condition is that the activities were not > refreshed in Sugar activities list when updated or, not added to the list > when installed. By race condition I mean the situation where the > BundleRegistry detects changes (e.g. in ~/Activities) too early, when [2] > activity.info is not available yet, so the bundle gets ignored. I > personally don't think is related to this issue. > > Now, looking at Tony's report and Sam's confirmation that this issue is > related to the change in [1], my first guess would be that the problem is > caused by the overhead generated by initializing the BundleRegistry, and > any other sugar module imported by it, every time the sugar-install-bundle > script is executed. Note that the script runs in a different process than > the sugar shell, so the registry instance returned by get_registry() is not > the same one as the one in the shell. Having SUGAR_PROFILE set doesn't > necessarily mean the script is being executed in the same context as the > shell. > > If my guess is confirmed, we should revise that change or revert it. > > Refs: > 1. [3]https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/commit/ > 64b4b2fba1c37a9ad92ed30eb669b68552b62415 > > On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 9:02 AM, Gonzalo Odiard <[4]godiard at gmail.com> > wrote: > > I am wondering if this issue ca be related to the race condition > detected > by Martin when the file monitor detect the activity before the [5] > activity.info file? > is saved to disk. > > Martin, do you have a patch to test? > > Gonzalo > > On Mon, Aug 31, 2015 at 10:00 AM, Gonzalo Odiard <[6]godiard at gmail.com> > wrote: > > Tony,? > If you can enable logging (remove the comment in the line > SUGAR_LOGGER_LEVEL > in the file /home/olpc/.sugar/default/debug) > And install one of the activities without unset the SUGAR_PROFILE > env variable, > and send the log, maybe we can understand better what is happening. > > I am afraid the slowness will impact Browse even if you patch it, > because Browse process > run in a environment with the env variable set. > > One more question: the time is bigger in slower devices (XO-1) than > in XO-4, > or is independent of the hardware performance? > > Gonzalo > > On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 7:34 PM, James Cameron <[7]quozl at laptop.org > > wrote: > > G'day Sam, > > Adding a flag for a workaround seems like you've given up.? ;-) > > Wouldn't it be better to fix the problem?? As you can see from > #4849 it occurs in Sugar, and only inside Terminal activity. > > Why is it happening? > > Why does it take up to 24 minutes to install Browse using > Terminal? > > Why does it take up to 5 minutes to install in Sugar 0.98? > > And yet only half a second if the bundle registry is bypassed? > > The bundle registry can't be that slow. > > By understanding the problem we'll be able to say whether it is > causing any other slowness of Sugar. > > -- > James Cameron > [8]http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > _______________________________________________ > Sugar-devel mailing list > [9]Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [10]http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel > > -- > Gonzalo Odiard > > > > -- > Gonzalo Odiard > > > > -- > Gonzalo Odiard > > References: > > [1] mailto:martin.abente.lahaye at gmail.com > [2] http://activity.info/ > [3] https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/commit/64b4b2fba1c37a9ad92ed30eb669b68552b62415 > [4] mailto:godiard at gmail.com > [5] http://activity.info/ > [6] mailto:godiard at gmail.com > [7] mailto:quozl at laptop.org > [8] http://quozl.linux.org.au/ > [9] mailto:Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org > [10] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/