<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">Hi,<br><br>The jupyter notebook seems like a good idea. Since it gives a lot of capabilities for the instructors to create interactive textual content. Evaluating on the time, I think it is very much achievable in a summer. Are you guys planning to take that ahead. If yes, I am also willing to contribute on the same. <br><br clear="all"><div><div dir="ltr" class="m_-6556066336940500454gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div style="font-size:small">Thanking You,</div><div style="font-size:small"><b>Utkarsh Dhawan</b></div><div style="font-size:small"><br></div><div style="font-size:small">Note:Please Consider The environment before printing.</div></div></div></div><br></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 10:00 PM Amaan Iqbal <<a href="mailto:amaaniqbal2786@gmail.com" target="_blank">amaaniqbal2786@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div>James Cameron wrote:</div><div>> You replied to me, but that wasn't me you quoted, it was Rahul.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Ya, I know. I just replied to all.</div><div><br></div><div>> However, it would be wrong</div>> to set expectations of colourful software by adding lots of colour to<br>> the web site.<div><br></div><div>I just meant to update the color palette, never to have many colors.</div><div><br></div><div>> We also need to remain accessible for vision impaired.</div><div><br></div><div>True!</div><div><br></div><div>> Activities for Sugar are presented by <a href="http://activities.sugarlabs.org/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">activities.sugarlabs.org</a> and by</div>> Fedora SoaS. Activities for Sugarizer are pre-bundled, not presented;<br>> you'll see the <a href="https://sugarizer.org/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://sugarizer.org/</a> web site is much better at<br>> getting people to engage with the software.<div><br></div><div>I was not knowing about the latter site. That's really good in terms of user engagement. </div><div><br></div><div>Overall I agree with your opinion James, and also of other board members and now I too feel this may not be one of the important projects for GSoC.</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks,</div><div>Amaan</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="m_-6556066336940500454gmail-m_-8117694297897996750gmail_attr">On Wed, Jan 23, 2019 at 7:19 AM James Cameron <<a href="mailto:quozl@laptop.org" target="_blank">quozl@laptop.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Amaan Iqbal wrote:<br> > > I don't expect revamping a website to be a _goal_.<br> > <br> > Without a proper website with the latest content, how can we expect<br> > the activities to reach the audience?<br> <br> You replied to me, but that wasn't me you quoted, it was Rahul.<br> <br> At the moment activities generally reach the audience through OLPC OS,<br> Fedora SoaS, <a href="http://activities.sugarlabs.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">activities.sugarlabs.org</a> and Sugarizer. Almost never the<br> web site.<br> <br> > > Even if we add a project for improving the website, 2 years down<br> > > the line we might again face a similar email pointing out the<br> > > drawbacks of the new model and another revamping of the website.<br> > <br> > This doesn't mean that we will have the same website with the old<br> > foundation 10 years down the line. Web technologies and standards<br> > have changed significantly in the past 2-3 years and its<br> > recommended we too keep our components updated. The main reason<br> > would be similar to why we are updating our activities. Fixing/<br> > Updating activities has to do with more engagement with current<br> > users and improving the website, to try for more new users. I guess<br> > both are equally important. <br> <br> That wasn't me you quoted, it was Rahul.<br> <br> Web site components can be kept updated by using a maintained open<br> source theme and not tweaking it as incessantly as we have been doing<br> with airspace.<br> <br> While it is similar in general to how we update our activities, this<br> is not relevant, because the web site is not an activity.<br> <br> > > Having less projects does not imply our failure in any sense, lack<br> > > of existing contributors might indicate that<br> > <br> > I agree, but it will be underutilization of potential of an<br> > organization which has participated in GSoC for last 10 successive<br> > years. We might consider having few more mentors this time if proper<br> > mentoring was the issue last time. Even if we are not having this<br> > project, we should think of utilizing GSoC to the fullest with tasks<br> > related to all the activities wherever significant work is<br> > pending. Further, even if we desire to have some new activities, we<br> > should think of including that too.<br> <br> That wasn't me you quoted, it was Rahul.<br> <br> I'm not worried about underutilisation of potential; there is plenty<br> to do, and if anyone is attentive and dutiful toward it they will<br> easily find what to do without having to do any updates to the web<br> site. I'm also not worried about having less active projects for this<br> GSoC, because we certainly have less active developers, and the last<br> thing we want is mentors who aren't active developers, as it leads to<br> under-mentoring; project never properly defined, mentor has little<br> idea of what the student is doing, and ultimately the student produces<br> code that isn't useful, or disappears. See Google Summer of Code<br> Guides, What Makes a Good Mentor?<br> <br> <a href="https://google.github.io/gsocguides/mentor/what-makes-a-good-mentor" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://google.github.io/gsocguides/mentor/what-makes-a-good-mentor</a><br> <br> Of course, our thanks to all those developers who have made small<br> updates to our software in the past few weeks, I appreciate it.<br> <br> > > I added why a user should get sugar.<br> > ><br> > > It’s still a work in progress as I figured even the last design<br> > > that’s under development now Wouldn’t really solve the problem. We<br> > > need MORE call to action buttons, more exciting colors, a better<br> > > navigation processes.<br> > <br> > That's what. I would too suggest improving the color palette we are<br> > currently using. The current color palette is not that pleasing at<br> > first sight. Also call to action and download buttons on the main<br> > page itself would be a good idea to improve the conversion<br> > rate. Further better and clearer navigation is also missing. <br> <br> That wasn't me you quoted, it was Peace. However, it would be wrong<br> to set expectations of colourful software by adding lots of colour to<br> the web site. Cart before horse error. First, we need Sugar and<br> Sugarizer to switch to using colour. Then can we increase the colours<br> on any web site that describes them. We also need to remain<br> accessible for vision impaired.<br> <br> Also, whether colours are pleasing is subjective, and dependent on<br> culture and environment. While you might not like the colours, they<br> have been accepted for some time, so you might provide more convincing<br> evidence than your own opinion of the colours.<br> <br> > > Hoping to move most primary information from wiki to the site,<br> > > instead of breaking their section on the site to go to wiki(it<br> > > lost them totally) <br> > <br> > This is the most important point. I strongly agree with this. Our<br> > website should only have the important information instead of the<br> > wikis. It breaks the flow and makes the user end up getting<br> > confused.<br> <br> That wasn't me you quoted, it was Peace. However, this content could<br> be placed in frames or transformed from GitHub or Wiki using a script.<br> We continue to have people who maintain GitHub and the Wiki and won't<br> maintain the web site. Content that has been copied to the web site<br> has languished unmaintained.<br> <br> > > This is as important as improving Sugar Labs tools. Without an <br> > > actionable site our tools won't reach our potential users. We need<br> > > the users (students parents, school administration) to be able to<br> > > download and use Sugar and every other Sugar Labs tools<br> > > effectively without stress then we can record an increase in<br> > > downloads of these tools we put in so much to build. <br> > <br> > This is why I thought of this idea. My primary intention is not to<br> > get anything revamped but to improve the way we present our<br> > activities to the user. Also for better maintenance, it is required<br> > that we keep our site up to date and consistent with the standards.<br> > <br> > Ultimately I would suggest that we should utilize GSoC to the<br> > fullest in any way we can, be it only with improving the activities.<br> > <br> > I will leave further discretion to the board members.<br> <br> That wasn't me you quoted, it was Peace.<br> <br> Activities for Sugar are presented by <a href="http://activities.sugarlabs.org" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">activities.sugarlabs.org</a> and by<br> Fedora SoaS. Activities for Sugarizer are pre-bundled, not presented;<br> you'll see the <a href="https://sugarizer.org/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://sugarizer.org/</a> web site is much better at<br> getting people to engage with the software.<br> <br> GSoC isn't there for us to abuse or on-sell, it's there to help us<br> with our goals.<br> <br> I'm sure the board will continue to listen to what people think. As<br> chair, nobody in the board has proposed any motion in relation to the<br> web site, but you've heard from Samson, Walter, and myself.<br> <br> > On Tue, Jan 22, 2019 at 6:18 AM James Cameron <[1]<a href="mailto:quozl@laptop.org" target="_blank">quozl@laptop.org</a>> wrote:<br> > <br> > Thanks. But my vote is no.<br> > <br> > It's not three months of coding.<br> > <br> > It doesn't solve a problem we have with our software products; Sugar,<br> > activities, Music Blocks, or Sugarizer.<br> > <br> > Our problem with the web site is with the content, in turn because we<br> > have had few content producers, and too many people proposing style and<br> > layout changes instead.<br> > <br> > Last month, or November, we had a team formed to do A/B testing, but<br> > the A/B testing has not yet begun. I'm guessing they are too busy.<br> > Perhaps it is time for more people to speak up in order to slow it<br> > down even further.<br> > <br> > On Mon, Jan 21, 2019 at 07:44:28PM +0530, Amaan Iqbal wrote:<br> > > Hello,<br> > ><br> > > I see we only have 6 projects so far in our Ideas list in comparison to<br> > 11<br> > > which were selected in GSoC last year. Being a successful Open Source<br> > > organization, I sincerely hope we have the potential of having many more<br> > > projects in GSoC this year(most probably 15+ if we can come up with such<br> > > promising ideas). <br> > ><br> > > Here I would suggest an idea for the renovation of our Website, [1]blog,<br> > and<br> > > creation of a customized/integration of existing CMS to our website from<br> > where<br> > > admins can create articles directly. Also some other web pages can also<br> > be<br> > > added to this list if I am missing something. The end product will be<br> > expected<br> > > to have :<br> > ><br> > > • Material Designed <br> > > • no/minimal redundancies in code<br> > > • faster load time<br> > > • Use of latest website standards<br> > > • Wider reach in terms of accessibility<br> > > • Faster and easier updates from the admins to the website<br> > > • Elimination of device specific issues<br> > > • Removal of most of the issues on [2]www-sugarlabs<br> > > • Easy setup for a new contributor<br> > ><br> > > After mentoring for few design tasks in GCI and collaborating with<br> > several pull<br> > > requests I found that the website was mostly constructed with many<br> > components<br> > > placed forcefully in their places including a search box in the navbar,<br> > such<br> > > that website looks somehow decent. But the design is not at all generic<br> > and so<br> > > as a result there use to be many small issues with looks and behavior of<br> > > components on different devices. Also, the website is not updated to the<br> > latest<br> > > web standards. <br> > ><br> > > Further, publicity in the best way with appropriate [3]accessibility of<br> > the<br> > > website is important for any organization and I sincerely hope this idea<br> > has<br> > > that potential.<br> > ><br> > > Looking forward to hearing your opinion on this before sending a Pull<br> > Request<br> > > on the GSoC ideas list.<br> > ><br> > > Regards,<br> > > Amaan<br> > ><br> > > References:<br> > ><br> > > [1] [2]<a href="http://planet.sugarlabs.org/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://planet.sugarlabs.org/</a><br> > > [2] [3]<a href="https://github.com/sugarlabs/www-sugarlabs/issues" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://github.com/sugarlabs/www-sugarlabs/issues</a><br> > > [3] [4]<a href="https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Learn/Accessibility/HTML" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Learn/Accessibility/HTML</a><br> > <br> > > _______________________________________________<br> > > Sugar-devel mailing list<br> > > [5]<a href="mailto:Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org" target="_blank">Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org</a><br> > > [6]<a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel</a><br> > <br> > --<br> > James Cameron<br> > [7]<a href="http://quozl.netrek.org/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://quozl.netrek.org/</a><br> > _______________________________________________<br> > Sugar-devel mailing list<br> > [8]<a href="mailto:Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org" target="_blank">Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org</a><br> > [9]<a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel</a><br> > <br> > References:<br> > <br> > [1] mailto:<a href="mailto:quozl@laptop.org" target="_blank">quozl@laptop.org</a><br> > [2] <a href="http://planet.sugarlabs.org/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://planet.sugarlabs.org/</a><br> > [3] <a href="https://github.com/sugarlabs/www-sugarlabs/issues" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://github.com/sugarlabs/www-sugarlabs/issues</a><br> > [4] <a href="https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Learn/Accessibility/HTML" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Learn/Accessibility/HTML</a><br> > [5] mailto:<a href="mailto:Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org" target="_blank">Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org</a><br> > [6] <a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel</a><br> > [7] <a href="http://quozl.netrek.org/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://quozl.netrek.org/</a><br> > [8] mailto:<a href="mailto:Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org" target="_blank">Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org</a><br> > [9] <a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel</a><br> <br> -- <br> James Cameron<br> <a href="http://quozl.netrek.org/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://quozl.netrek.org/</a><br> </blockquote></div> _______________________________________________<br> Sugar-devel mailing list<br> <a href="mailto:Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org" target="_blank">Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org</a><br> <a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel</a><br> </blockquote></div></div>