<html> <head> <meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> </head> <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> Hi Sebastian If you think the design is bad, you have had several weeks to bring this to our attention. Even now, I would appreciate some insight into your concerns. Your assertion that 'This is likely not possible because activities may be saving state at any time (supposedly it happens on every "change of view") so really "not saving" would be at best ignoring few seconds of work and at worst, losing a day's worth.' has been answered repeatedly. The problem is that the activity is saving against the jobject_handle given by the resume. This means these changes change the original so that the user can not go back. This is contrary to the expectations of users and is really a flaw in the design presumably introduced when the 'keep' button was removed. The solution which Utkarsh has implemented is to clone the jobject when the activity is launched. This way these changes are made to a new object. When the user quits, if the user changes the name of the project, it is saved as the new jobject under the new name. No action is taken re the original. If the user does not change the name, the new jobject is saved and the original is deleted as at present. You have repeatedly said that there was a risk of work being lost. This is only if the user chooses not to keep it. Since the user can erase a Journal entry at her discretion, the only risk of loss is by a system action. If that happens, it will not be a consequence of the design. <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 07/11/2016 02:40 PM, Sebastian Silva wrote: </div> <blockquote cite="mid:88edf938-05d3-b1aa-4e48-791793e85aff@fuentelibre.org" type="cite"> <meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> Hi Tony, We have been discussing the design of this feature since a thread in early June [1]. Since then, Utkarsh has worked on the "jsfiddler" [2] which is not what was proposed in the "Sugar on the Ground" proposal. [1] <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.mail-archive.com/sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org/msg41998.html">https://www.mail-archive.com/sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org/msg41998.html</a> <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"> <pre style="font-family: courier, "courier new", monospace; font-size: 14px; white-space: pre-wrap; word-wrap: break-word; margin: 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 19.6px; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">As part of Sugar-on-The-Ground GSoC project, Tony has proposed to reenable the automatic save-as dialog that some found annoying when exiting activities.</pre> <pre style="font-family: courier, "courier new", monospace; font-size: 14px; white-space: pre-wrap; word-wrap: break-word; margin: 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 19.6px; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; widows: 1; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">The proposal is to add a 'don't save' option as a strategy to avoid journal clutter. I would like to ask for input from the community on this topic. Also if somebody could point Utkarsh to the Sugar version where this was removed so that he may find the code and start from there. After some digging, I could not find it either in changelogs or in git history. If I remember correctly this was removed in Dextrose first. </pre> I am eager to help Utkarsh complete his proposed features. That's why I tried his patch and gave feedback where I thought it was appropriate. I understand your need to test on fedora 18 (currently you use Sugar 0.106, if I understood correctly). Perhaps there are rpm files for Sugar 0.109.1 which was just released, that could serve as a good base. [2] jsfiddler patch <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2016-April/052346.html">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2016-April/052346.html</a> <div class="moz-cite-prefix">El 11/07/16 a las 03:23, Tony Anderson escribió: </div> <blockquote cite="mid:57835792.6050005@usa.net" type="cite">Hi, Utkarsh I must apologize for trashing your PR. It takes a lot to get me angry, but yesterday I was. </blockquote> <...> Going back to Design: <blockquote cite="mid:57835792.6050005@usa.net" type="cite"> To me the essence of this feature is two-fold: 1. To require users to supply a title-supplied-by-user. </blockquote> I suggested that the initial text for the entry be as it is now "xxx Activity" instead of blank. You are proposing changing it to "Untitled". <blockquote cite="mid:57835792.6050005@usa.net" type="cite"> 2. To enable users to resume an activity, make some changes and then decide to make the result a new instance - preserving the original. This is why the feature is called 'save as', because that is how user's do this in most document-handling applications. Currently, this is not possible in Sugar. </blockquote> This is likely not possible because activities may be saving state at any time (supposedly it happens on every "change of view") so really "not saving" would be at best ignoring few seconds of work and at worst, losing a day's worth. <blockquote cite="mid:57835792.6050005@usa.net" type="cite"> I don't know if it is possible, but I would suggest withdrawing this PR and creating a new one - same code, of course. Then I think there needs to be a gif animation and explanation of the feature. At that point, comments would be welcome. </blockquote> The PR is perfectly overwritable with the command `git push --force`. That said, I had only asked for a branch in his git fork, but a PR is perfect. <blockquote cite="mid:57835792.6050005@usa.net" type="cite"> My understanding of this is the PR is the developer's presentation of the result of their work to be reviewed for merging into the master. It is not a design forum. </blockquote> It could well be, as it is quite accessible. We seem to be having a design <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar-toolkit-gtk3/pull/327">discussion</a>. Animations are welcome any time of course. In the meantime nothing beats testing the patch. <blockquote cite="mid:57835792.6050005@usa.net" type="cite">Before work is done on creating the code represented by the PR, the design should be done. No developer can code without knowing the intended outcome. Naturally, comments on the PR may result in changes to the code but changes made from a working base. </blockquote> This was my concern since June. I have only read what I consider very poor requirements and perhaps that is why, having tested it, I still don't understand the intent of the implementation. <blockquote cite="mid:57835792.6050005@usa.net" type="cite"> In the end, the developer's may indeed reject this and other PRs and thus prevent many Sugar users from benefiting from them. That would be sad. However, it is open source and it certainly can and will use be used in deployments. This, of course, is one of the great freedoms in free software. </blockquote> I can only agree in underlining the importance of freedom. Have a great week. <blockquote cite="mid:57835792.6050005@usa.net" type="cite"> Tony </blockquote> </blockquote> </body> </html>