[Sugar-devel] [Feature] Social Help

Gonzalo Odiard godiard at sugarlabs.org
Wed Apr 22 14:31:07 EDT 2015
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I prefer keep the standard Sugar toolbar, and if needed modify the css in
the server.
We can use the same viewhelp.py window, just switch a url when the user
press a button.

Don't know what other think.

Gonzalo

On Tue, Apr 21, 2015 at 8:01 PM, Sam P. <sam.parkinson3 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Gonzalo,
>
> Both sugar-network and discourse use fixed toolbar.  They are also very
> trendy now with material design and stuff :)
>
> Theoretically we could change them, but it is much easier for us to do the
> merged toolbar.  It is like 1 line of CSS change vs whole toolbar change.
>
> Thanks,
> Sam
>
> On Wed, Apr 22, 2015 at 8:40 AM Gonzalo Odiard <godiard at sugarlabs.org>
> wrote:
>
>> Sam,
>> You don't loose all the space, because you don't need a fixed toolbar in
>> the server.
>> Is content, and the content will scroll.
>>
>> Gonzalo
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 21, 2015 at 7:27 PM, Sam P. <sam.parkinson3 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Gonzalo,
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 21, 2015 at 9:29 PM Gonzalo Odiard <godiard at sugarlabs.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 20, 2015 at 7:28 PM, Sam P. <sam.parkinson3 at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Gonzalo,
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Apr 21, 2015 at 3:37 AM Gonzalo Odiard <godiard at sugarlabs.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> But if the server url can be configured (as in the proposal)
>>>>>> In theory you could Sugar Network too at the server side, right?
>>>>>> We only need define a standard way to provide context, like a
>>>>>> parameter for the bundle_id
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, that is possible.  The api is very simple, the webview URL is set
>>>>> to:
>>>>>
>>>>>     SERVER/goto/BUNDLE
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Should be good check and agree with Sugar Network developers.
>>>> Could be a good idea add the nick name and the user colors as
>>>> parameters?
>>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> So, you could make sugar network respond to this, add a redirect or
>>>>> create a separate redirector server (as I do with
>>>>> socialhelp.sugarlabs.org).
>>>>>
>>>>> It also has the merged native/web toolbar.  The webview adds the class
>>>>> "sugar" to your document body so you can then compensate for the 55x55
>>>>> close button on the top right.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> I would prefer use just the standard Sugar toolbar.
>>>> If the page design change, or you use another server (like Suugar
>>>> Network) or if you
>>>> have a monitor with different pixel size, the merged toolbar will look
>>>> wrong.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I have to disagree with you here.
>>>
>>> For pixel size, websites just use em for the toolbar instead of px.
>>> Sites like sugar-network seem to already be doing this.  You must use em in
>>> order to not look like tiny font on the xo anyway.
>>>
>>> For other services, it is super duper easy to integrate.  For example,
>>> this is all the CSS needed for discourse:
>>>
>>>     .sugar header.d-header {
>>>         width: -webkit-calc(100% - 2.813em);
>>>     }
>>>
>>> Or for sugar-network:
>>>
>>>     .sugar #toolbar {
>>>         width: -webkit-calc(100% - 2.813em);
>>>     }
>>>
>>> And even if the app does not have a toolbar, it is just a little button
>>> in the top right and it looks fine.
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> You lost 55 px, but you remove complexity and gain flexibility.
>>>>
>>>
>>> 55px is very important.  On some platforms, it is actually even 75 px.
>>>
>>> You loose 55px top padding, 55px bottom padding, 55px sugar toolbar and
>>> then ~55px for the web toolbar.  That brings the total to 220px or 300px on
>>> a device with XO pixel density.  What that equates to is very small.  I had
>>> a go on my XO [1], and there was only 7cm height left for the content
>>> (almost same for discourse and sugar-network)!
>>>
>>> I understand that the XO is not our only platform.  But on a small
>>> laptop, adding more toolbars is just counterproductive.
>>>
>>>
>>>> We can use the same viewhelp.py, just adding a toggle bottom to switch
>>>> to
>>>> the social help (at the left, the only buttons aligned at the right are
>>>> the Stop buttons)
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The idea of a toggle in the bottom left sounds good.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Sam
>>>
>>> [1]  http://imgur.com/FJFAcpl
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> Regarding the proposal, I would like to see this more integrated with
>>>>>> the Help view.
>>>>>> Then the changes would be:
>>>>>> * Don't show two entries in the menu, one for the local help and
>>>>>> another for the social help.
>>>>>> First, because in the cases where we have a help for the activity, is
>>>>>> a good idea show
>>>>>> that first, and add a button to go o the server if configured.
>>>>>> * Right now, we show the Help menu only for activities with local
>>>>>> Help available.
>>>>>> We should show the menu always, and if not local help is available go
>>>>>> to social page.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you have a UI design in mind?
>>>>>
>>>>> Here is a quick mockup to start the conversation if you want:
>>>>> http://people.sugarlabs.org/sam/mockup.png
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> My main concern with this feature is how to solve the change to
>>>>>> webkit2 without break
>>>>>> all the webservices. I think we should include the main (and working)
>>>>>> webservices in the sugar code,
>>>>>> port them to webkit2, and then land this feature.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> That sounds like a good idea.
>>>>>
>>>>> If worst comes to worst, we could use webkit1.  webkit2 has the new
>>>>> shiny stuff and webkit1 is old, we will have to move someday and why not
>>>>> before there are way too many web services!
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Is good know we have that alternative if we can't land all before May
>>>> 18.
>>>> Maybe you can use webkit1 to land the feature and nake the change later.
>>>>
>>>> Gonzalo
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Sam
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Gonzalo
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 20, 2015 at 2:17 PM, Sebastian Silva <
>>>>>> sebastian at fuentelibre.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Hi,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For some reason this email found it's way into gmail's spam folder.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However the topic is very important.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I disagree that this implementation needs to be adopted.
>>>>>>> In particular, most deployments still don't have a reliable
>>>>>>> connection to the Internet and we don't want to introduce a dependency on
>>>>>>> it. Social help might (and should) come from peers first.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However, work has been ongoing from different deployments in this
>>>>>>> (social) direction so it's generally accepted that Sugar needs it. Our own
>>>>>>> work in Perú has been aligned with Alsroot's work on the Sugar Network ( we
>>>>>>> developed the first UI, here's a short video explaining it:
>>>>>>> http://somosazucar.org/2012/06/04/un-avance-de-la-red-azucar-0-3-sneak-peek-of-sugar-network-0-3/
>>>>>>> ).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This work is ongoing. It involves a very light local server capable
>>>>>>> of synchronizing user resources asynchronously (including comments,
>>>>>>> bundles, etc) *in both ways*.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The effort is very much appreciated. I think we need to morph the
>>>>>>> proposal into something that is generic or pluggable, and try to work with
>>>>>>> Alsroot on this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>> Sebastian
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 19/04/15 20:59, Sam P. wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>   Hi All,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  One feature I'm proposing for the 0.106 cycle is Social Help.
>>>>>>> Social Help was previously proposed by Prasoon Shukla as a GSOC project,
>>>>>>> however my proposal is slightly different.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Patch Link:  https://github.com/sugarlabs/sugar/pull/483/commits
>>>>>>>  Feature Page:  http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Features/Social_Help
>>>>>>>  YouTube Video Summary:  https://youtu.be/_WzwVZ60Tbw
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  I would like to invite discussion on the feature so we can land
>>>>>>> this for 0.106.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Thanks,
>>>>>>>  Sam
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Sugar-devel mailing listSugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.orghttp://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> I+D SomosAzucar.Org
>>>>>>> "icarito" #somosazucar en Freenode IRC
>>>>>>> "Nadie libera a nadie, nadie se libera solo. Los seres humanos se liberan en comunión" - P. Freire
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Sugar-devel mailing list
>>>>>>> Sugar-devel at lists.sugarlabs.org
>>>>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Gonzalo Odiard
>>>>>>
>>>>>> SugarLabs - Software for children learning
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Gonzalo Odiard
>>>>
>>>> SugarLabs - Software for children learning
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Gonzalo Odiard
>>
>> SugarLabs - Software for children learning
>>
>


-- 
Gonzalo Odiard

SugarLabs - Software for children learning
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