[Sugar-devel] [DESIGN] Etoys 4.1

[Walter Bender]

On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 7:07 PM,  <forster at ozonline.com.au> wrote:
> Sugar's autosave can be a problem in other Activities too.
> Create a program in Pippy, then look at one of the examples. All your work will be overwritten. There is nothing you can do to prevent this, not even a panic powerdown. I have viewed a favourite holiday photo in Browse, then used that Browse session to surf the net, overwriting that photo (can't replicate that now OS373pyg).
>
> I would be happy to have a global setting in control panel for all Activities for autosave vs a dialogue which gave a choice on exit. Would that break existing Activities?
>
> Though there is a case for autosave for raw beginners, its contrary to Sugar's goal of empowering users to give them no control of when saving occurs.
>
> Tony
>
>
>> On 31.08.2010, at 20:07, Gary Martin wrote:
>>
>> > Hi Vert,
>> >
>> > On 30 Aug 2010, at 10:50, Bert Freudenberg wrote:
>> >
>> >> This is the first beta release of Etoys 4.1.
>> >>
>> >> The biggest change is that stopping the Etoys activity will no longer save to the Journal. To save, you will have to press the keep button. The octagonal stop button is replaced by a circular exit button to indicate the new behavior. It puts up a warning before actually quitting.
>> >
>> > :-(( but I'm sure this was a really tough decision to make.
>> >
>> > Do you have a screen shot of the new UI and warning dialogue that I can easily take a look at?
>> >
>> > My first gut reaction (not having seen it yet) is that the Keep button is a real problem generally (and causes confusion and misunderstanding in Sugar). Habitually training kids to click that icon each time before exiting will, for all other activities, generate many confusing duplicate Journal entries over time and make matters even worse.
>> >
>> > For the Etoys case, as a workaround for not knowing your clean/dirty state, I think having the regular Stop UI button that when clicked _always_ displayed some sort of "Do you want to Keep the changes to this project in the Journal?" Keep/Don't Keep dialogue. That way kids can just keep clicking the Stop button without worry in all activities, and it's just that the Etoys pop-us up and extra dialogue when they do click Stop there.
>> >
>> > Apologies if this is already what your new "warning before actually quitting" dialogue does :)
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> > --Gary
>>
>> Well, you can try it in sugar-jhbuild.
>>
>> Or on your XO or SoaS:
>>
>>       http://etoys.laptop.org/
>>
>> As usual, the Keep button saves a copy in the Journal. Unlike in Etoys before, it now brings up a dialog to edit the project details, followed by a dialog to chose the save location - either the Journal (preselected) or to "the cloud" (Squeakland). On repeated saving the dialog is not shown again.
>>
>> Clicking the Exit button does not offer to save, it just warns about losing unsaved changes. There is no Stop button. This should avoid confusion with other activities.
>>
>> - Bert -
>>
>>
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The design goal is that we'll have versioning, in which case, you can
select a version of your liking. But lacking that, what to do?

-walter

-- 
Walter Bender
Sugar Labs
http://www.sugarlabs.org