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Walter,
</div><div><br></div><div>I don't think it is apples and oranges. Certainly Facebok or Google Plus would be much more valuable and friendly to the teachers than the wikis are.</div><div><br></div><div>I am wondering how to organize a group of integration volunteers to serve as those middle people.</div><div><br></div><div>Gerald</div>
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<p style="color: #A0A0A8;">On Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 9:32 AM, Walter Bender wrote:</p>
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<span><div><div><div>On Sun, Feb 3, 2013 at 9:25 AM, Gerald Ardito <<a href="mailto:gmanb5@gmail.com">gmanb5@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div>Sean,</div><div><br></div><div>I appreciate your comments about teachers.</div><div>As a teacher who has used Sugar and the XOs extensively, and has trained</div><div>other teachers to do so as well, I can say that things can sometimes be very</div><div>difficult.</div><div><br></div><div>I sometimes feels like there is a middle layer missing in the process, a</div><div>layer that would let teachers be able to get some support with their</div><div>intentions, but that doesn't necessary involve development.</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>It is somewhat apples and oranges, but when I was in Amazonas and</div><div>asked where the teachers hung out, they all say, with out hesitation,</div><div>Facebook. I didn't ask them to join the #sugar IRC channel to help</div><div>them over the inevitable bumps in the road, or to navigate the wiki,</div><div>but rather, we set up a Facebook page where they could get help with</div><div>those "middle" things. I'm 100% certain that US teachers use Facebook,</div><div>so we should too, if we want to engage them.</div><div><br></div><div>-walter</div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div><br></div><div>Gerald</div><div><br></div><div>On Sunday, February 3, 2013 at 8:29 AM, Sean DALY wrote:</div><div><br></div><div>It's clear that anything other than pre-installed raises a barrier</div><div>most teachers don't want to deal with. However, getting Sugar</div><div>referenced with an OEM is far easier said than done. And Apple is not</div><div>particularly motivated to encourage others to boot non-Apple OSes on</div><div>their hardware.</div><div><br></div><div>In the meantime, we have to make the difficult as simple as possible.</div><div>This includes installers and documentation including videos.</div><div><br></div><div>I don't want to underestimate teachers' motivation to find software</div><div>for their students, either. I have found that Sugar's unbeatable price</div><div>and nonprofit orientation are consistently appreciated by teachers.</div><div><br></div><div>Sean</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>On Sun, Feb 3, 2013 at 2:06 PM, DancesWithCars <<a href="mailto:danceswithcars@gmail.com">danceswithcars@gmail.com</a>></div><div>wrote:</div><div><br></div><div>do you all think installing a VM is easier than</div><div>making a LiveCD, or SOAS and rebooting?</div><div><br></div><div>Most Macs these days are Intel,</div><div>it's the hardware compatibility to get something</div><div>to boot from BIOS, and other issues, AFAICT...</div><div><br></div><div>Of the kids and adults I've talked to, over the years</div><div>(realizing most people here have more experience)</div><div>they don't bother unless an XO-1.x or better is put</div><div>before them... They fall in love with the hardware,</div><div>the cuteness factor, and if it's on a regular machine</div><div>(even the RPi I've tried a few on), it's a no go,</div><div>generally...</div><div><br></div><div>Not that it's not worth having, jhbuild, sweets, VMs, etc</div><div>are all good, but most non technical people won't</div><div>try it, AFAICT...</div><div><br></div><div>---</div><div>odd nonstandard keyboard so who knows what I intended to type...</div><div><br></div><div>On Feb 3, 2013 7:21 AM, "Thomas Gilliard" <<a href="mailto:satellit@bendbroadband.com">satellit@bendbroadband.com</a>></div><div>wrote:</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Sean;</div><div><br></div><div>I just did a cleanup of the wiki pages covering Virtual Box and Importable</div><div>appliances</div><div>deleted a lot of obsolete information and their links [5]</div><div><br></div><div>I updated:</div><div>Downloads [1] [2]; Fedora_18 [3]; and Sugar_on_a_Stick [4] wiki pages</div><div><br></div><div>Tom Gilliard</div><div>satellit on #sugar freenode IRC</div><div><br></div><div>[1]</div><div><a href="http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Downloads#Virtual_Machines_on_all_platforms">http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Downloads#Virtual_Machines_on_all_platforms</a></div><div>Links to Virtual Box Appliances :</div><div>[2] <a href="http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_Creation_Kit/VirtualBox">http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_Creation_Kit/VirtualBox</a></div><div>Links to Soas-v8:</div><div>[3]</div><div><a href="http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Fedora_18#Sugar_on_a_Stick_v8_.CA.BB.C5.8Chelo_.CA.BBai">http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Fedora_18#Sugar_on_a_Stick_v8_.CA.BB.C5.8Chelo_.CA.BBai</a></div><div>[4] <a href="http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick">http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick</a></div><div>This page is still not updated, you have to scroll down to find SoaS-v8</div><div>[5] <a href="http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Special:RecentChanges">http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Special:RecentChanges</a></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>On 02/02/2013 04:14 PM, Sean DALY wrote:</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>For the past couple of years, our homepage has linked the Sugar on a</div><div>Stick (SoaS) badge to the SoaS page [1] and the "download" menu item</div><div>and "Try it with a child today" link to the Downloads page [2].</div><div><br></div><div>The downloads page rightly in my view orients visitors by platform,</div><div>but the two largest market share desktop/laptop OSes (Windows & MacOS,</div><div>96% or so of market) only give instructions for Sugar on a Stick and</div><div>the "Do you use a virtual machine?" link misses the excellent VMs</div><div>available (in particular the VMs of... SoaS!).</div><div><br></div><div>I think teachers will self-classify by OS and virtually none of them</div><div>will self-classify as virtual machine users.</div><div><br></div><div>Teachers will also expect pancake button 1-click installers (this was</div><div>confirmed by Sloan Marketlab study), problematic with SoaS due to</div><div>necessary USB stick manipulation and still a bit hairy on a Mac.</div><div><br></div><div>I think Windows section and Mac section should both propose choice of</div><div>SoaS and using VirtualBox with a SoaS VM, explaining benefits of each</div><div>method in layman's terms.</div><div><br></div><div>VMs are far less disruptive for trying Sugar, as a teacher can</div><div>download to hard disk, install and run, keeping usual apps going</div><div>(mail, browser, word processing) while experiencing Sugar.</div><div><br></div><div>The downside is of course massive files to download, but that could be</div><div>mitigated with torrents and/or mirrors.</div><div><br></div><div>Comment please before we get into wiki editing of this crucial page</div><div>thanks</div><div><br></div><div>Sean</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>[1] <a href="http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick">http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_on_a_Stick</a></div><div>[2] <a href="http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/DocumentationTeam/Try_Sugar">http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/DocumentationTeam/Try_Sugar</a></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>_______________________________________________</div><div>SoaS mailing list</div><div><a href="mailto:SoaS@lists.sugarlabs.org">SoaS@lists.sugarlabs.org</a></div><div><a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/soas">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/soas</a></div><div><br></div><div>_______________________________________________</div><div>Marketing mailing list</div><div><a href="mailto:Marketing@lists.sugarlabs.org">Marketing@lists.sugarlabs.org</a></div><div><a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/marketing">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/marketing</a></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>_______________________________________________</div><div>Marketing mailing list</div><div><a href="mailto:Marketing@lists.sugarlabs.org">Marketing@lists.sugarlabs.org</a></div><div><a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/marketing">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/marketing</a></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>-- </div><div>Walter Bender</div><div>Sugar Labs</div><div><a href="http://www.sugarlabs.org">http://www.sugarlabs.org</a></div></div></div></span>
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