OK, not even wrong. That sounds like an awful lot of potential. <div><a href="http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/File:Bbrot225x225x24.PNG">http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/File:Bbrot225x225x24.PNG</a></div><div><br></div><div><br></div> <div>; )</div><div><a href="https://lateral-exponential.notnil.org/">https://lateral-exponential.notnil.org/</a></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div class="gmail_quote">On 28 August 2011 16:12, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:mokurai@earthtreasury.org">mokurai@earthtreasury.org</a>></span> wrote:<br> <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">Sorry, Sean, but as Wolfgang Pauli used to say, "Not even wrong."<br> <div class="im"><br> On Thu, August 25, 2011 6:19 pm, Sean Linton wrote:<br> > Perhaps recently the culture of mathematics education, at least since<br> </div>> Newton's *Principia *<br> <br> Euclid's Elements, please. Principia is a book of physics, not math, and<br> you are late by two millennia. Newton's full title is Mathematical<br> Principles of Natural Philosophy.<br> <div class="im"><br> > has been just that, *principles* handed down<br> > a perceived hierarchy, from a *prince*. May be based on<br> > genuinely useful descriptions and definitions, but as the Garfunkel<br> > article<br> > in the NYTimes suggests not really reflective of the pan-archy in which we<br> > find ourselves today, where many types of mathematical skill set need to<br> > be<br> > acknowledged for our inter-networked society.<br> <br> </div>See<br> <div class="im"><a href="http://replacingtextbooks.wordpress.com/2011/07/28/what-do-mathematicians-and-scientists-do-all-day/" target="_blank">http://replacingtextbooks.wordpress.com/2011/07/28/what-do-mathematicians-and-scientists-do-all-day/</a><br> <br> </div><div class="im">> A better mathematics education might involve less "abstract reasoning",<br> > but<br> > also generally less heralding by teachers of untestable *principles* to<br> > students who are not yet equipped to decide for themselves. Let the<br> > children<br> > decide in what way a mathematical concept is a useful description by<br> > building implicitly ('abstract', 'reason', 'energy', . . . concepts which<br> </div>> bind things together; *Ratio Legis*) from the ground up, *Ã * la<br> <div class="im">> Bronowski's<br> > *The Ascent of Man *for example.<br> <br> </div>No thank you. A fine expositor, Bronowski, but not for primary school<br> children. Jean Piaget is your man for unraveling how children come to form<br> mathematical ideas. Hint: Not like grownups, and even less as grownups<br> imagine.<br> <div class="im"><br> > Describe before you prescribe . . . or<br> > ascribe to George Bush a *principle* of *punishing failure* to pass<br> > standard tests?<br> <br> </div>???<br> <br> See <a href="http://samanthadouglas.wordpress.com/2011/07/28/give-100-percent/" target="_blank">http://samanthadouglas.wordpress.com/2011/07/28/give-100-percent/</a><br> <br> > Who or what was Math anyway that Â¡ all the children in the world ! really<br> <div class="im">> need to be doing his home work every night?<br> <br> </div>???<br> <br> Sour grapes?<br> <br> What mean all these mysteries to me<br> Whose life is full of indices and surds?<br> x²+7x+53<br> = 11/3<br> <br> Lewis Carroll, A Tangled Tale<br> <br> > ; D<br> <br> ;<{Þ}}}<br> <br> ...Euclid alone<br> Has looked on beauty bare. Fortunate they,<br> Who though once only, and then but far away<br> Have heard her massive sandal set on stone.<br> <br> Edna St. Vincent Millay<br> <div class="im"><br> > XO<br> > Sean<br> ><br> ><br> > On 26 August 2011 09:19, Steve Thomas <<a href="mailto:sthomas1@gosargon.com">sthomas1@gosargon.com</a>> wrote:<br> ><br> >> Alan,<br> >><br> >> Okay, I'll bite, I can see how you believe the "standard curriculum" is<br> >> way<br> >> off, but what part of their proposed solution do you disagree with and<br> >> where<br> >> do you see as the preferred paths?"<br> >><br> >> In particular in the article they state "*Science and math were<br> >> originally<br> >> discovered together, and they are best learned together now." which I<br> >> assume<br> >> you agree with based on past writings.*<br> >><br> >> I can see how you might disagree that learning Latin has no value (I<br> >> have<br> >> learned a lot from attempting to learn smalltalk).<br> >><br> >> My fear in what the authors suggest is that the "real world" problems<br> >> will<br> >> be like what I saw in 1902 textbook Algebra Text by<br> </div>>> Milne<<a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=DhU4AAAAMAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=inauthor:%22William+James+Milne%22&hl=en&ei=27VWTvfzIqjd0QGLo6DRDA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=book-preview-link&resnum=5&ved=0CEEQuwUwBA#v=onepage&q&f=false" target="_blank">http://books.google.com/books?id=DhU4AAAAMAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=inauthor:%22William+James+Milne%22&hl=en&ei=27VWTvfzIqjd0QGLo6DRDA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=book-preview-link&resnum=5&ved=0CEEQuwUwBA#v=onepage&q&f=false</a>><br> <div><div></div><div class="h5">>> which I found in an ice cream shop on Cape Cod (I only go to the best<br> >> ice cream shoppes ;) The book was filled with "real world" problems<br> >> (and<br> >> little visualizations or age appropriate concrete tasks/objects kids<br> >> could<br> >> relate to) for ex:<br> >> [image:<br> >> books?id=DhU4AAAAMAAJ&pg=PA356&img=1&zoom=3&hl=en&sig=ACfU3U1k1CWXvlkhypODoZuTWebG14bH1Q&ci=93%2C458%2C873%2C105&edge=0]<br> >><br> >> I look forward to your response, the destruction of my existing beliefs<br> >> and<br> >> being freed to learn :)<br> >><br> >> Stephen<br> >><br> >> On Thu, Aug 25, 2011 at 4:38 PM, Alan Kay <<a href="mailto:alan.nemo@yahoo.com">alan.nemo@yahoo.com</a>> wrote:<br> >><br> >>> Hi Walter<br> >>><br> >>> As with a number of other issues in education, I strongly disagree with<br> >>> both of the main opposing sides. Both the standard curriculum, and<br> >>> these<br> >>> guys, are way off IMO.<br> >>><br> >>> Cheers,<br> >>><br> >>> Alan<br> >>><br> >>> ------------------------------<br> >>> *From:* Walter Bender <<a href="mailto:walter.bender@gmail.com">walter.bender@gmail.com</a>><br> >>> *To:* iaep <<a href="mailto:iaep@lists.sugarlabs.org">iaep@lists.sugarlabs.org</a>><br> >>> *Sent:* Thursday, August 25, 2011 9:47 AM<br> >>> *Subject:* [IAEP] food for thought...<br> >>><br> >>><br> >>> <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/25/opinion/how-to-fix-our-math-education.html?_r=1&ref=opinion" target="_blank">http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/25/opinion/how-to-fix-our-math-education.html?_r=1&ref=opinion</a><br> >>><br> >>> -walter<br> >>><br> >>> --<br> >>> Walter Bender<br> >>> Sugar Labs<br> >>> <a href="http://www.sugarlabs.org" target="_blank">http://www.sugarlabs.org</a><br> >>><br> >>><br> >>> _______________________________________________<br> >>> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)<br> >>> <a href="mailto:IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org">IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org</a><br> >>> <a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep" target="_blank">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep</a><br> >>><br> >>><br> >>> _______________________________________________<br> >>> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)<br> >>> <a href="mailto:IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org">IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org</a><br> >>> <a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep" target="_blank">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep</a><br> >>><br> >><br> >><br> >> _______________________________________________<br> >> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)<br> >> <a href="mailto:IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org">IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org</a><br> >> <a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep" target="_blank">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep</a><br> >><br> > _______________________________________________<br> > IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)<br> > <a href="mailto:IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org">IAEP@lists.sugarlabs.org</a><br> > <a href="http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep" target="_blank">http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep</a><br> <br> <br> </div></div><div><div></div><div class="h5">--<br> Edward Mokurai<br> (默雷/धर्ममेघशब्दगर्ज/دھرممیگھشبدگر<br> ج) Cherlin<br> Silent Thunder is my name, and Children are my nation.<br> The Cosmos is my dwelling place, the Truth my destination.<br> <a href="http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Replacing_Textbooks" target="_blank">http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Replacing_Textbooks</a><br> <br> <br> </div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>