[IAEP] Funds for local cost

[Adam Holt]

$900 for a visa alone is far too much -- whether or not this money all
disappears -- if the French govt turns it down, they are making a big
mistake, but it could happen.  Whether it's up-to-$900 of Sugar Labs money
that would disappear, or up-to-$900 of Scratch money that would disappear?
(*)

Should the Sugar Labs Board consider allocating $500 maximum (with
receipts) to Sugar Network and $500 maximum (with receipts) to Samson's
visa effort both, each with their own risks/rewards -- so that investments
in different continents occur (somewhat) more equitably?

I spent less than $500 over 3 WEEKS in West Africa, Lagos, etc (including a
very similar visa escapade, working with a very similar
embassy/consulate).  In my case I spent less than $200 TOTAL (including
intercity buses, intracity buses, and the very similarly priced visa, mine
cost more than Samson's estimated $127 visa fees) and indeed took many days
to make this happen.

So we need to bring this to a conclusion in a more humble manner than
throwing money around.  Or speculating on ungodly currency
fluctuations/conversions til the end of time.  Myself I could not spend
$500 in Lagos over a week if I tried, even if I get 1000 more emails from
Samson explaining to the world that I'm an idiot.  Obviously Samson is
coming from a very different upbringing.  So let's be respectful of that.
If he's willing to meet in the middle and be resourceful on his own end,
then we can move forward~


(*) How do we get this in writing (who exactly is stuck with the bill if
the French govt regrettably turns down Samson) so everyone can vote their
conscience, truly understanding what's being proposed?


On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 10:41 AM, Samson Goddy <samsongoddy at gmail.com>
wrote:

> I totally understand,
>
> I don't  have friends or family in Lagos, the only person i made contact
> with, is someone i met in a conference at Port Harcourt. All my contacts,
> family members are all in the south-south region.
>
> The person i made contact with stays in Ikeja the capital of lagos. Where
> i am going is 2 hours(if there are no traffic) away from the
> consulate(lekki). He has lot of family members staying with him. I can't
> force my way in.
>
> Previously i proposed to stay in lagos for 3 days but it was recommended
> by the consulate that i can stay up to a week but not a must.
>
> I don't know where in lagos you said you stayed or what year? Because all
> of these things were proposed based on how things are in 2017.
>
> I am not using SL money to live large in lagos, i dont see how 15,000 per
> night is expensive? Please dont use the dollar to judge this proposal
> because we don't use dollar in Nigeria. We convert them to naira.
>
> I used this sign for a reason ~€800 but to be precise is €744. Why?
> Because the naira gain or lose every hour.
>
> Please make some research about what is going on in Nigeria currently.
>
> The team in Bordeaux spent around $300 for my passport and some things
> that needed to be done to get my passport while in Port Harcourt.
>
> Now i am going to lagos, booking flight and you expect the proposal to be
> the same while i did just my passport without traveling?
>
> Samson
>
>
> On May 31, 2017 2:38 PM, "Adam Holt" <holt at laptop.org> wrote:
>
> Why spend up to $300 of Sugar Labs' piggy bank to save yourself an hour
> or two?  (I've crossed Lagos many times, in traffic, and in this case we
> hope only 1 or 2 visits to the French Consulate are required!)
>
> Please could you Samson consider your friend's home in Lagos (for many of
> those nights, if a consular wait is required) particularly if in the end
> you do not like (highly-reviewed) $20-30/night Airbnb rooms in Lagos?
>
> I am not asking you to live like the other Nigerians I know (who like
> myself, In Fact choose to stay in Lagos more humbly for $10-20 total per
> day, but please also find ways to respect those/all who choose to live a
> more lo-fi lifestyle in a hi-fi world, as Sugar Labs' seeks to invest its
> piggy bank broadly across all nations' most dynamic learning communities
> where possible!!)
>
>
> On May 31, 2017 8:02 AM, "Samson Goddy" <samsongoddy at sugarlabs.org> wrote:
>
> On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 12:37 PM, Adam Holt <holt at laptop.org> wrote:
>
>> On May 31, 2017 3:53 AM, "Samson Goddy" <samsongoddy at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 1:51 AM, Adam Holt <holt at laptop.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 7:56 PM, Samson Goddy <samsongoddy at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hello all,
>>>>
>>>> This is a spinoff motion [1] from the previous one i proposed. The main
>>>> purpose of this proposal is to help support my trip to bordeaux especially
>>>> on local expenses. This is a well thought proposal, since the community
>>>> can't afford to send me and ibiam to bordeaux. I made a solo motion for
>>>> just me, because the scratch team will be taking care of my flight and
>>>> hotel cost in france.
>>>>
>>>> As per Adam's request on the last motion. My plan is to get money from
>>>> scratch team to cover the ~800 euros cost for this proposal then get
>>>> reimbursed if i successfully get my visa for travel. So the community will
>>>> not border about losing money if i don't get the visa.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Can you break down this $~900 (€800) into a more precise budget please,
>>> explaining exactly what's needed?  Thanks as the following paragraphs don't
>>> give enough information to understand why $~900 is being sought:
>>>
>>
>> What i need exactly is 260,000 nigerian naira which i see now is $826.
>> But the nigerian local go up and down every hour towards the dollar, euros
>> and pounds. I will be changing the local currency from either euros or
>> dollar to my local currency and also buy euros again with the naira when i
>> want to leave Nigeria.
>>
>>
>> 1. Return flight to Lagos $200 via Arik Air
>>
>>
>> +1 so we don't have to argue with your parents (bus to Lagos worked for
>> me).
>>
>> 2. An uber or taxi from the local terminal (Airport) to Lekki where i
>> supposedly will be staying for 1-6 working days. (15,000 nigerian naira)
>>
>>
>> My Lagos airport bus, including a connection to cross the city, was about
>> $2.
>>
>
> I still do not know how you did it, well i am guessing when you came to
> Nigeria was 2015, 2016 period. Because, i travelled to lagos when i was
> going to nairobi(April 2017), and it took me 5,000 naira to move from the
> local terminal airport to the international airport by a cab. So imagine
> heading to a place that is 2:30 minutes away from that same airport.
>
>>
>> 3. I called the consulate in lagos, they advise me to stay for minimum of
>> 1 week, so that if they need any supporting document they can easily tell
>> me to rush down to their office without coming from Port Harcourt again. So
>> i will be staying for 1-6 days in lagos (80,000 to 90,000)
>>
>>
>> Airbnb.com has many well-reviewed rooms incl WiFi for $20 to $30 per
>> night.
>>
>> $10 to $20 per night options also exist on Airbnb (insist on reviews, to
>> avoid fraud).  Personally I stayed in low-end hotels for about $5 to
>> 10 per night, as I did during my 3 weeks in West Africa.
>>
>> You friend's home in Lagos (per the original plan) might also be an
>> option.
>>
>
> Yeah, my friend's place is far from lekki, so that is not an option.
>
> Expensive hotel rooms in Lagos are from 60,000 per night to 1 million
> naira compare that to 15,000 naira per night room in one of the most
> expensive environment in lagos.
>
> My hotel bill is 15,000 naira per night.
>
>>
>> 4. The closest hotel i have seens so far is 20 minute drive to the
>> consulate's office.  So taxi fares will be included, i can't be sure of how
>> much they pay because Lekki is one of the V.I.P areas for rich folks in
>> lagos.
>>
>>
>> I traveled to 10 different neighborhoods in Lagos and never paid more
>> than about $1 for the bus.  My linguistic skills are low (luckily yours
>> are not, still keep GPS handy) but I always got to my destination quickly.
>>
>> 5. Since it takes 15 working days to processes a visa i will have to pay
>> for consulate endorsed or affiliated courier to bring my visa and passport
>> to Port Harcourt where i live, since i can't stay for 15 working days.
>> Prices are unknown to me, i will know when i go to lagos.
>>
>>
>> Understood.
>>
>> 6. My feeding
>>
>>
>> I was able to eat well in Lagos for $2/day.  Of course I avoid fancy
>> restaurants, unless a business meeting requires that.
>>
>> 7. Miscellaneous
>>
>>
>> Progress.  But can you tell us the rough cost of the visa itself?
>>
> Everything thing including the visa and processing is close to 40,000
> naira.
>
> What year did you came to lagos? was it 2017? what was the exchange rate
> of dollar when you travelled? Did you stay in Lekki?
>
> $2 dollars is 700 nigerian naira, so i don't see how you eat well with 700
> Nigerian naira. Because even local places in Port Harcourt 700 naira can
> barely get you a breakfast not to talk of eating 3 times a day, i don't
> know you appetite lolz.. Even hamburgers in lagos is around 1,500 naira not
> to mention food.
>
>
>
>> *Note: *All this are just estimate, because it might go higher based on
>> the real time exchange rate of foreign currencies to my local currently.
>> This are very expensive in Nigeria, please don't use Google to check prices
>> of things in Nigeria because they are not accurate everything goes up and
>> down in hours.
>>
>> FYI, when the scratch team offered pay for my passport in April,  they
>> saw on the internet that my people under 18 in Nigeria pays 15 thousand for
>> passport. But when i got to the immigration office, i paid 30,000 nigeria
>> and additional 10,000 to get the passport quicker.
>>
>> So  $~900 is recommended because the exchange moves every hour. Things
>> are expensive in Nigeria because people rendering the goods and service
>> uses the black market rate for some selfish reasons.
>>
>> See Aboki FX
>>
>> https://abokifx.com/ for daily prices of things in Nigeria how dollar
>> affect things.
>>
>>
>> Samson
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> "First all the embassy in Nigeria are either in Lagos or Abuja. So he
>>> has to stay in Lagos or Abuja for the period of obtaining the visa. This
>>> will cover return flight cost from Port Harcourt to Lagos or Abuja.
>>>
>>> I took the bus to Lagos (and the passengers were extraordinarily
>>> gracious) but if you must fly Port Harcourt to Lagos/Abuja because your
>>> parents don't allow you to take the bus, that is (about) $100 in each
>>> direction.
>>>
>>> i have to go to lagos so that i can stay in a friend’s place, but cost
>>> of food will be on it too. The Visa processing takes about minimum of 15
>>> days, but if the Scratch team request i go to Abuja instead for the visa.
>>> The costs of my hotel bills will be covered by them.
>>>
>>
>> I am heading to lagos not abuja, Abuja is a very expensive city to live
>> for 1-5 days in hotel.
>>
>>>
>>> Great if Scratch has offered to cover hotel bills in Abuja (which might
>>> not even be needed if you stay in Lagos?)  Why is Scratch potentially
>>> requiring you visit Abuja?
>>>
>>
>> Sorry that was before, i forgot to remove it. I will be staying in lagos
>> for the visa processing.
>>
>>>
>>> This money will also serve for transporting me to the different
>>> locations in Bordeaux for the conference. The Conference will be taking
>>> place in 3 different areas in Bordeaux, also some taxing fees we’ll have to
>>> pay before we can leave Nigeria to France."
>>>
>>> http://www.scratch2017bdx.org/en/map-of-venues/ says the entire week's
>>> transportation costs should be €13, or free if a bikeshare is used
>>> according to http://www.scratch2017bdx.org/en/getting-around/
>>>
>>> Thanks Samson for clarifying, so people can vote based on a very real
>>> budget projections.
>>>
>>>
>>> I hope this get seconded so that it can be voted upon
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [1] https://docs.google.com/document/d/152VDfUcdcGOHOFBLT3lG
>>>> 15sUFpzBeuBCGiNAGCSOLj4/edit?usp=sharing
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>> Samson G
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
>>>> IAEP at lists.sugarlabs.org
>>>> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>>
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>>
>>
>>
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>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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