[IAEP] [Sugar-devel] Assessment in Karma

Christoph Derndorfer e0425826 at student.tuwien.ac.at
Mon Aug 24 06:01:05 EDT 2009

Hello Tony,

thanks a lot for your comment which is definitely some more great food 
for thought (on top of Martin's earlier comments).

I'll have to spend more time thinking about this issue and, more 
importantly, talking to the educational folks here at OLE Nepal before I 
can start to wrap my head around this...


forster at ozonline.com.au schrieb:
> Hi
> We mostly assess that which can easily be measured rather than that which relates to the important education outcomes. Lower order skills as defined in Blooms Taxonomy, simple recall, rather than understanding and creating. So far its OK, an understandable response to the realities. 
> We then measure the effectiveness of education by these assessments. Teachers and students then concentrate on the learning which is more easily assessable. From generation to generation we are all embedded in this system and come to believe that that which is assessed is the goal of education.
> Bad practice is already entrenched in national curricula, does automating bad practice (lower order assessment) mean that it can be done in less time, leaving more time for good practice, or does it further entrench bad practice? That seems to be the central point in this discussion. I don't have an answer, but for me, automating lower order assessments would be a low priority project.
> Tony
>> On Fri, Aug 21, 2009 at 3:58 AM, Bryan Berry<bryan at olenepal.org> wrote:
>>> I agree that automatic assessment is no magic cure-all but it does free
>>> teachers from a lot of drudgery in grading worksheets.
>> I understand your point, and respect your good intentions. I worry --
>> quite a bit -- about the outcome however...
>>> Teachers should be grading student essays not arithmetic exercises or
>>> vocabulary exercises.
>> What I worry is that once we automated arithmetic exercises, they'll
>> focus on that... as you say....
>>> We especially need automatic assessment for contexts where teachers
>>> don't have time to grade homework, like Nepal, India, Pakistan, etc.
>> So they don't have time for either. We automate one, and the fact that
>> we provide easy to get, easy to use grades takes over. They still
>> don't have time for essays.
>> [ The sad thing I find is that they *will* find time to make pretty
>> graphs of the paltry numbers they get. The graphs make the teacher
>> look good and in control. ]
>>> I think that Karma is approaching from a much different vantage point
>>> than teachers in the developed world do. We are not looking to capture
>>> "excellence" but rather diagnose if kids are having trouble with basic
>>> skills and give kids instant feedback rather than make them wait a week
>>> to get their graded homework back, if it ever comes back.
>> John Hattie, in pretty developed NZ, has done a lot of work on that
>> exact track ("early diagnosis of kids falling behind on basics" and
>> "instant feedback"). Hence Asttle.
>> Maybe I am a luddite and it'll happen anyway. Hmmm.
>> m
>> -- 
>>  martin.langhoff at gmail.com
>>  martin at laptop.org -- School Server Architect
>>  - ask interesting questions
>>  - don't get distracted with shiny stuff  - working code first
>>  - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff
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Christoph Derndorfer
co-editor, olpcnews
url: www.olpcnews.com
e-mail: christoph at olpcnews.com

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