[Its.an.education.project] [earthtreasury] Re: The rest of the puzzle
echerlin at gmail.com
Thu May 15 23:39:53 CEST 2008
I'm going to break this conversation into separate threads for
electric power generation, corruption, and income generation in the
villages. We can continue to discuss electric power on peripherals,
and the other subjects on other lists.
On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 10:55 AM, Yama Ploskonka <yama at netoso.com> wrote:
>> pay for power if it becomes available in this way? What other business
>> opportunities arise in a village if there is a modest amount of
>> fuel-grade alcohol available?
> No opportunities exist in the present state of corruption, except those
> depending on corruption, like drug trafficking, for example. Everything
> else is merely survival.
>> I am thinking now of potato power. I assume that there is in the
>> villages generally the knowledge, skill, and equipment for fermenting
>> potatoes and distilling the resulting alcohol/water/plant residue mix
>> into 95% ethanol. It is my impression that the uplands of Perú are
>> excellent potato-growing areas. Hm, yes, potatoes originated in Perú,
>> which has more than 3,000 varieties. I'll need to know the market
>> price of potatoes in the villages, and the cost of the resulting
>> ethanol. We will have to help to get the ethanol from the vodka level
>> to the fuel level. Well, this
>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethanol_purification> will do to get the
>> conversation started.
> You know, it's better business to do so for the vodka, and then use that
> money to buy gasoline. One little problem, producers might drink that
> vodka. That is why producing your own ethanol is illegal in most places
> of the world, the government wants taxes on it. So OK, you make a law
> that people can make ethanol, but should not drink it, or should pay
> taxes on it. Sure.
> With the levels of corruption existing, no one can realistically think
> this will work. I'm sorry, but that's the way it is.
>> Another possibility seems to be a hybrid system using solar power for
>> half the year, and microhydro in the cloudy/rainy season. Well, we
>> must run the numbers and find out.
> Well, double expense to begin with. Again, won't pay itself because
> there are no opportunities for business, because of corruption, etc...
>> I have contacts in sustainable fuels, business, and engineering, but I
>> wouldn't turn down any others that people here come up with. What
>> mailing lists, social networking sites, and other places can we ask
>> these questions on? I know that we can ask on LinkedIn.
> Unless you have contacts with someone who can do something about
> corruption FIRST, all the rest is moot. Yes, they will spend the money,
> they will get their picture. Changes for the people?
> The list of goodwill projects that have been a waste of resources, not
> solving anything, is long and growing. See and weep, and this is just
> ONE list.
>> We also need a grant writer. Doubtless some of you can suggest other
>> needs. Let's hear them.
>> > From a "practical" point of view... it was right (and it is) that OLPC
>> > worries about the lack of energy (electricity)
> Jensen has announced publicly the matter was solved, with the hand crank
> charger and with solar, in Peru...
>> No. OLPC has done a lot to make the XO low in power consumption, but
>> has done nothing, zip, nada, about creating power solutions for
>> customer countries. It's odd, with all of the MIT enginering talent
>> around, that Nicholas never asked the question, but there it is.
> Oh, he did. He did even spend an undisclosed sum on Potenco and
> demonstrated in front of the camera. And the OLPC enthusiasts have
> swallowed it whole. But I don't think it is fair to blame him, but
> rather our own gullibility and refusal to come forth when we knew that
> made no sense. I don't know when Potenco presented his report, but it
> has never been made public.
> Bottom line, even if we get the machine there, and get it to run, will
> it train entrepreneurs? or is it expected that once we have artists and
> creators galore, someone outside will pay their salaries?
> At least we can talk. Thank you, Ed. Sorry for being such a sourpuss,
> but I call 'em as I see 'em
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